[JOE SANOK]
This is the Practice of the Practice podcast with Joe Sanok, session number 604.

Well, welcome, welcome, welcome. I am so excited that you are here today for the Practice of the Practice podcast. I just want to talk about a couple other things we have going on. Group Practice Launch, the doors have opened. So if you are at that point where you have a solo practice and you want to add that first W2 or 1099, and you just don’t want to waste a whole bunch of time and you want some expert help with that, Alison Pidgeon and Whitney Owens are doing Group Practice Launch, which is a six month program that walks you through that first hire and getting all the systems set up. So you can head on over to practiceofthepractice.com/Group Practice Launch, and be a part of that cohort for the next six months. It’s just amazing to see how people go from not having anyone work for them to being able to continue to grow their team and all of those different things.

So we hope that your world is going awesome this week. I am so dang excited to have my friend Allie today on the show. Ally Casazza is just a Rockstar. I brought her into Next Level Practice to talk as an expert a while back. She’s the host of The Purpose Show, which is a top rated podcast and the creator of online courses that have given just huge international attention, including a new book that is out this week called Declutter Like A Mother. Also Allie is a friend of mine. I’ve hung out with her and her husband, Brian and her family in California. She’s an amazing, wonderful woman that is just changing the world. So Allie, welcome to the Practice of the Practice podcast.
[ALLIE CASAZZA]
Yes. Hey friend, thank you so much for inviting me on. I’m super excited. I’m super excited that our books are coming out around the same time and I love anytime we get to work together. I love it.
[JOE]
I know. The concurrent paths are just amazing how, you know we’re on the same on Harper Collins and we have the same editors and it’s just so funny to just see how our lives are parallel in many different ways.
[ALLIE]
Yes, yes, for sure.
[JOE]
So I am so excited to talk about the book. I want to first just hear a little bit about why minimalism? What happened in your life where you’re like, “I need to just like cut back a little bit on the stuff we have.”
[ALLIE]
It’s interesting because I talk to so many people every week on this topic. My business has evolved and expanded so much in the last, I mean, I’ve been blogging for about, almost 11 years. It’s been a business for the last five, but I’ve been in this space for a decade and I’ve talked to a lot of people and people are most of the time usually kind of like what you just said. Like, I feel I just kind of need to peel back. Things just don’t need to be this complicated. It’s funny because my story is actually like super dramatic and I’m like, oh my gosh. I’m always worried people will think like I’m amping it up to like, make my point and it’s like, no, it was terrible. It was one of the worst times of my life and it was very dark and I’m always very real about it.

And then minimalism and kind of just simplifying my space really was a catalyst for everything else in my life, opening up, shifting having space to evolve, space to think, and problem solve. Other parts of my life that had nothing to do with minimalism, so really like bringing in a more minimal outlook really did change my life. So it was about, at the time we’re recording is it was like eight or nine years ago. Yes, nine years ago that I had just had my third baby and I was really, really struggling. I definitely had been depressed actually for a while, even through my pregnancy, just because of some situations going on in my personal life and with money and family stuff.

It was very, very stressful, a really, really hard time and we were going to have to like move in with my parents with this new baby and these other kids. I just felt like really stuck and out of control of how things were going. We ended up staying in our house and making it through so we didn’t have to move in or anything like that. But I’m in this house, we had done the whole, like the old American dream thing where you get a job and get a house and the biggest house you could possibly get approved for. We had this big house that we didn’t even need and it was full of stuff. We had the first grandchildren on both sides so there was a lot of overgiving a lot, a lot of toys.

The dining room in the house was actually the first room you would see when you entered the house and it didn’t even have a dining table in it. It was like a toy room. It was like an open toy room with no door so you could see it from the kitchen, from the entryway, from the family room. And it was just full of those like colorful plastic bins on shelfs and each shelf and bin was overflowing with toys. So my toddlers at the time would go in there and just pull stuff out and dump it and wander off two seconds later, bored because they were hell of over stimulated. And kids don’t play well in those kinds of environments.

My whole house was like that just a bunch of stuff for no real reason that was actually pulling away from the quality of our lives, overstimulating all of us and really just creating an environment of tension. There was way too many clothes, clothes that we didn’t even really like or need, but we had bought. So we just kept them, especially because we were really broke at the time. So I think that scarcity mindset absolutely had a say in that as well. Everything just was like in that energy of just overwhelmed, overstuffed for no reason, but afraid to get rid of anything and not realizing that all of those things will take up your space and your time. So, because my house was so overstuffed, I was constantly working to just keep it maintained. I was blogging, I wanted to turn that into something bigger, which I eventually did obviously. My husband was working really, really long hours, six days a week. I never saw him. I felt like I didn’t have any help. It was really hard. And I had three under three.

Not only was I making things harder on myself, but my actual season of life really truly was difficult. So I was struggling with depression, I was feeling like I had this life that I had wanted where I was a mom and I had these kids and I married my junior high sweetheart. I’ve known Brian forever and we had this life that we wanted, but I was really struggling with it. And for that, I felt so guilty. So it was just like all of these things on top of each other, the actual overwhelm, the over cluttered house, the constant need to clean up, never being able to get on top of anything. I felt like I was getting my kids out of my way constantly in order to catch up on the housework. And then I never actually caught up though.

So that was the place that I was in when I really just kind of had this breaking point. And I kind of just locked myself in my bathroom one day and just sat on the floor and cried and just really wanted to find an answer. I wanted to figure out, like, why do I suck at this so bad Is this motherhood? The mom culture out there says that. Yes it is. It’s a joke. It’s a shit-show. Like it’s always going to be overwhelming, coffee all day and then wine and then they’re finally in bed and you can have the moment to yourself, but then you got to do it all over again the next day. Like it’s very desperate and very negative and I was caught in that big time.

What really pulled me out was that day in the bathroom, like just realizing that I was reacting to my life and to my home and instead of my home being a place that supported me in this beautiful life that I could have been living, it didn’t feel beautiful at the time, but these gifts and this life that I wanted, this gift of my kids, of motherhood; motherhood is forever but raising your kids is actually really, really temporary. I just felt like I was missing all of it. And for what, for books that we aren’t going to read again? For stuff I don’t need for clothes that don’t fit me anymore because my body had changed? What was I even doing? I just wondered if things would get better if I just didn’t have so much crap and that was really the spark of it. There wasn’t a bunch of books trending on minimalism. I didn’t even know it was called minimalism. There wasn’t documentaries. I had no idea. I just had this wild thought and decided to try it at desperation. And really what happened was I got my life back. I got my time back. I physically created space in my home and that metaphorically created a lot of space in my life and more time and more joy and more energy. My energy skyrocketed because I wasn’t having to like react and catch up all the time. So yes, it was really a catalyst for a better life.
[JOE]
You’re talking my language. I feel like us being in this camper since September, and obviously when this goes live, we’ll be done with the camper, at least that’s the plan for a while, but just even, I’m standing right here and I have my water bottle I’ve used since September. Above it there are three water bottles I have not touched since September. So even being in a camper, being like we brought these backup water bottles, it’s like, why are they even here? I’ve used one water bottle that I love for like seven months. And how much of our life is like that, where we have the backup water bottles and we just don’t need it. It is so refreshing to be able to say, what are the things that I use on a regular basis that help me feel like I live a good life, might help my kids feel inspired while not clogging everything up? So it’s just so refreshing to hear you talk about that.

For you, when you think about, at least for me, when I think about writing a book, so Thursday is the New Friday is coming out, Declutter Like A Mother this week is coming out. The big question that at least my writing coach said to me is why is this a book and not a podcast or not an e-course or not just like a blog post? When you think about Declutter Like A Mother, why is this a book instead of a YouTube video? Tell us a little bit about the depth you go into. Because I think to a lot of people, they just think, “Well, we just got to get rid of stuff. That’s not a book. That’s just like a one sentence.” What’s the depth you go into this book that really differentiates it?
[ALLIE]
Yes. That’s a really good question. I love it. It’s so much. I was rereading the book like one last time last night, because we’re recording this in April, I was reading it one last time before the final, final everything and I was noticing like the actual decluttering, talk doesn’t even start till chapter five because the whole first section is this deep, deep dive into like really big perspective shifts about what got you here, why would you even pick up this book? If you pick up the book, like you’re in a position where you feel like you could use it, even if it’s light and it’s a little bit and you just like kind of want to make things lighter for yourself or if you’re incredibly overwhelmed and you heard my story and you were drawn to the book because of that reason. There’s so much that we need to cover. There’s studies that have been done that show the effects on people and particularly on women as it relates to their space because we’re so interconnected with everything and everything affects us and men are like waffles and women are spaghetti. So it’s just more difficult for us to compartmentalize.
[JOE]
Wait, wait, wait. I’ve never heard that. What is that?
[ALLIE]
Never heard of that? Okay, men are waffles, women are spaghetti. It’s saying men can compartmentalize and women, everything is connected. All the noodles are touching.
[JOE]
Okay, got you.
[ALLIE]
So yes, and that is very overly simplistic, but you know what I mean. Like we feel everything and it’s all connected and for everyone, men and women, it’s connected. How you feel about your space affects you. So just really getting really, really deep into all of that. And the thing for is, and probably why I don’t have too many friends in the minimalist niche because as I grew my blog and started sharing this really actually ended up becoming a trend, which is awesome because it’s so needed. But a lot of people in the minimalist community have these like rules and they have these videos on YouTube and things that are like showing how, what little amount of stuff they have and how minimal they live. And it almost kind of became this like idolized contest or something.

And also, I just saw it real the other day and it just made me realize, man, like this whole thing has just really gotten now. It’s like another thing to shame ourselves for like, not being minimalist enough, not doing minimalism right. So I even hesitate to call it minimalism. And I say that in the book. The first sentence is “I don’t care about minimalism.” If you need to call it something else, call it something else. I’m going to use that word in the book, but it doesn’t need to be that. This is about removing excess, the crap that’s in your way, the crap that’s taking up your time, the crap that’s the reason that you’re constantly maintaining and can never catch up. You can’t focus on your business. You can’t focus on your kids. You’re always pulled another direction. There’s always more things to wash and put away. There’s always more to maintain and it’s stealing your quality of life. Clutter is more than just something that needs to be moved out of the way. It’s a freaking thief. It steals from us. It takes up so much space, energy and time. And really clutter is like stagnant energy because it’s unmade decisions. In one way or another clutter is just unmade decisions. And when you are surrounded —
[JOE]
Oh my God, I got to pause you right there because my heart explode it in a good way when you said clutter is unmade decisions. Did you say that, clutter’s unmade decisions?
[ALLIE]
Yes. And think about it. Can you think of any amount of clutter in your home that does not boil down to an unmade decision?
[JOE]
Not at all. I mean —
[ALLIE]
Even the bottles of water, the water bottles you said, you didn’t make a decision. You hesitated because you felt like you need it. What if I need this? And you didn’t make the harder decision. So if you’re going to, like, first of all, clutter is relative. So if you are saying, I count that as clutter and my camper, I count that as clutter now that’s unmade decisions. Like, are you going to toss it, are going to donate it, or you just going to carry it around to all 50 states?
[JOE]
I’ll carry it around to all 50 states, unfortunately. I think, I’m looking at one water bottle, it’s a Practice of the Practice water bottle. I’m like, “oh, I could give it away.” And then I’m like, “Oh no, I had my last name engraved on it. So I guess I have to keep it, but why do I have to keep it? I don’t use it.” And it’s like, I made a decision.
[ALLIE]
And see you’re in the decision spiral right now and that is what’s so hard is because we make decisions all freaking day. So your decision fatigue is so real. I’m sure you read that article, I have a bookmark in Psychology Today. I don’t know where it originated from, but I can send it to you if you want to include it in show notes but that article that talked about decision fatigue and really kind of like discovered it and went into depth on what it is and how it affects everyone. We are literally making decisions all day. Some are just like pretty inadvertent, kind of subconscious but most of them are not. It’s kind of like using up brain calories in your brain and taking up space and taking effort and energy. So when we have clutter, also like clutter on our desk, clutter in our drawers, clutter in the bathroom cabinets that we’re looking for, the hairspring in the morning clutter, when we open the cabinet to get our toothbrush out, clutter in the junk drawer when we go to find scotch tape, like just all over the place, it is sending messages into our subconscious mind and it is more unmade decisions. It is literally spiking cortisol and causing stress unnecessarily.
[JOE]
Oh my gosh, I love everything you’re saying. So I want to —
[ALLIE]
That’s like the stuff I go into in the book, like what to do about it. And that is like every main section of your house. It’s like all the things
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[JOE]
So let’s take the typical person. I know a lot of your audience is female, and I don’t want to just assume that only females are listening, but so the average person, average parent, they’ve got a bunch of clutter, they feel stuck, have all these unmade decisions. I want to start with psychologically, what’s happening for that person by not decluttering, by not reading your book by not doing your courses? If they aren’t doing that work, what does that do to them?
[ALLIE]
Basically, you’re kind of just living typical. You’re really just kind of like accepting, this is like the way that, I mean, I want to, I always say America, but really this is worldwide. Culture is just kind of like materialistic and at least in America, since that’s where I live and that’s where you live, everybody goes to Target and comes back with more than they went for. Everybody shops online and just has packages coming all the time. Everybody just buys a new one without getting rid of the old one first. Like everyone’s just accumulating. Almost everyone has a pretty large amount of square footage in their house and a storage unit and a garage full of crap they haven’t used in a year or more. Everyone, this is just normal.

So when you’re not doing the work, and this is not like ongoing for forever, it’s the actual digging and getting the stuff out. It can be one and done, but then you’re just maintaining a lifestyle. It’s like health, not dieting, but like eating well and loving your body and taking care of yourself. You might need to do an initial purge and really take a look at what you’re eating and take a look at what’s in your house and throw stuff out and get rid of stuff and realigning yourself with your health goals, but moving forward from there, then it’s just maintenance. It’s just making different decisions when you’re at a restaurant. And this is the same way. You’re just making different decisions as you’re living your life and you have a system for paperwork coming in and toys coming in for the kids and et cetera, et cetera.

But when you’re not doing the work like that and you choosing to go that route, you’re really just in a place where life is kind of happening at you. Things are just coming in. You’re really enslaved to your things. And your stuff is really like in charge of you instead of you owning your stuff and it’s really just backwards. The other thing that I want to say that, I like to give different examples because different things will grab different people, but the other thing is money. In the book, I walk you through, like, let’s look at this financially and let’s look at how much money you make every month and then how much of that money goes to the place you live in. Some people have multiple places. Like Joe, you’re in your camper right now. So like you maybe would want to account for that and your, house and anything else going on.

And I would do the same thing, like how much is my house every month, whether it’s a mortgage or a rent or whatever. And then how much of that money that you’re bringing in are you spending on your house? What’s the percentage? For most people, unless you have a paid-off house, most people, the bulk of their monthly budget is spent on their space. So really giving that perspective, like you’re paying for that square footage, how much of the square footage is totally not working for you? Not only is it not working for you, but it’s actually actively working against you because of decision fatigue, because of what takes up your space and takes up your time. And you’re literally paying most of your money a month for a space that’s absolutely not working for you, that’s stealing your time and your mental energy, your brain calories, like the example I gave earlier, and making life harder, making you more stressed when your home is really supposed to be a place of support.
[ALLIE]
It’s supposed to be a Haven really. It’s supposed to be where you get work done and make memories happen and feel good. It’s your safe space. So to really kind of get mad about it, that this is where I’m spending most of my money and it’s not even working for me because I just have a problem with taking ownership and I have too much stuff, it kind of you off for a second. And then that, like, if you don’t get to that place, you are going to live like that. How many times a day or week, a month have you complained that you don’t have enough time? And Joe, this is what you teach, like how to have more time and maximize this and optimize that and have more time. And this is another strategy we can use to do that as clearing what doesn’t matter out of our physical space. And it really literally creates more time.
[JOE]
Oh, a hundred percent. Now you’ve worked with thousands of people to help them do this. I would love to hear when people start to do this, and you kind of tapped into it, what’s the flip side of it? When people really embrace this, they get stuff out of their life, they physically clean up their space and Declutter Like A Mother like what happens?
[ALLIE]
It’s so crazy. And this is the thing too. I’m glad you asked this because it’s different for almost everybody. It’s like the same, but it’s different specifics. Most of the time, the messages that I get, especially like DMS on Instagram, people are like, “Oh my gosh, I watched your webinar or I found you on your podcast or whatever and I was thinking like, well, I’m not in that bad of a position. I just want to make things easier and I’m feeling a overwhelmed. So I’m just going to try. I’m just feeling super reluctant, but I’m going to try.” And then they come back and they’re like, “Oh my gosh, I literally had dinner sitting on my bathroom counter tonight because my bathroom is where I started and it’s the cleanest room in the house. It feels so good. The energy flow in there is so good. I don’t want to be anywhere else in my house. I can’t wait to get the rest of my house like that.

It’s such a huge shift and people feel it so much. They like will eat in their closet or their bathroom, or have their morning coffee in their kids’ room or wherever they started, because they’re so excited to be in the energy of a space that is working with them, which all your spaces absolutely can. Even if you work full time at corporate or have a really overwhelming schedule, or you’re a mom of 10 kids, it really doesn’t matter. Your home needs to be supporting you. We also like work in the book and in the programs to make things very relative to who is taking it and who needs the help, who’s reading it. So really kind of assessing who are you in each room? Who you are in your kitchen is going to be different than who I am in my kitchen. Who you are in your room is going to be different than who I am in mine, and what you need.

You know, a single mom that’s working, two jobs is going to have different needs in her bedroom to support her for all the stuff she has to do when she wakes up in the morning versus me, I’m married and my life, my mornings are really slow. My room is a space where I do Pilates and I’m resting and recharging, and I’m also sharing it with another person. That’s going to be different for me than for her. So just really making it like you have this like relative custom method to take and apply to your life and really simplify in a way that feels really good, that’s not legalistic, that’s not following a bunch of rules, that you know is going to stick because it was made custom for you, by you and I together through the book and through the programs.
[JOE]
So awesome. I mean, we have thousands of counselors that are listening to this and they all have 10, 20, 30 clients. So I mean, the reach here is huge. Take us through just maybe three main points or takeaways of what people will get from this book as a clinician or as recommending this book to their clients.
[ALLIE]
Oh, that’s a good one. I feel like really a deep understanding of space and the environment. Your environment affects you so much, so, so much. I think it’s Marshall Goldsmith, I don’t want to butcher that name, somebody I have quoted it in the book, but in the book triggers he’s talking about how your environment affects you and he basically the whole book about, and there’s an amazing quote from him is basically saying that if you don’t control your environment, your environment is going to control you. Like who’s owning who? It’s really your choice. So being able to help your patients and yourself really, and any one that you come into contact with understand that their environment is absolutely having an effect on them. Whether they choose to take ownership of it or not, it’s affecting them the same way.

If we use that to our advantage and we decide to take ownership and we do something about it and we manipulate the environment to work with us, like I’ve been saying, and for us and be supportive of us and our families and our work and our lives, the amount of joy that I’ve seen come from just that, despite, this always opens doors for people. I always hear from women that have started businesses because they felt so free, they ended up having another a baby when they previously felt like they had to stop, even though they felt like they weren’t done, because they didn’t think they could handle it. They started homeschooling. They started traveling, like whatever it is. But let’s leave all of that out and there’s no other benefits. Let’s pretend it’s just this, just the joy and the freedom that comes from taking ownership of your environment and knowing how to make it work with you for you is huge.

The mental health benefits, for me personally, I mentioned in the beginning that I was really struggling with depression at that time in my life. And I have tended to go there. If I’m being honest, that’s kind of a tendency that I have to kind of dip and I really haven’t struggled with it since then. I had struggled with it my whole life and once I figured that out and I realized that I’m in control of my space and I can clear that off of me, I have not had the issues that I’ve had with depression. I felt personally that it was very situational and I was in this environment that was not conducive for joy, for growth, for me to be in charge of anything. I was completely owned by my stuff and not the other way around.

So it’s really crazy because it feels very surface and kind of feels like something that would go on your would be nice list rather than like, this is really important, but it’s foundational and it’s everything. So I think that foundation, that understanding for your patients, for yourself, the benefit of knowing that your environment is working you is huge. And then also the practical side, if you were to give this book to someone or read it yourself is huge. I’m going to go into it with you and really get into the nitty gritty and be like, okay, here’s our strategy. These are the questions to ask. This is how you make these decisions. We’re going to go into a season together where we are making extra a decisions for a short while so that you’re making far less decisions, long term. And again, the mental health benefits, the emotional health benefits, the lifestyle that comes from somebody living like that is such a lighter, better way to live. It’s a total game changer.
[JOE]
Yes. I really like that you bring in your personal, around depression and that I feel like it’s so easy for clinicians to say, you need to read this book about why you should sleep more or you need to read this book about why nature is really good for kids to reduce ADHD, but you never hear clinicians say if you had less crap in your house, I think that your mental health would be better. And I feel like this book should be one of those books because when people come into our offices and they say, “Oh, my kid has all these behavior issues,” for example, we almost always start with, “Okay, how are they eating? Are they eating a bunch of sugar? Did they have core strength and tummy time as a kid? Are they sleeping well? What are they like at home or at school? How are they around friends?”

We do all these assessments, but we don’t say how much crap is in your house. Like maybe your mental energy is, they’re responding to that. And I feel like this book is such a great way to just add to that. We want to get all of those magnifying factors under control before we start diagnosing and saying, “Oh my gosh, you have these huge behavioral issues.” No, like if a kid’s not sleeping well and they’re eating a bunch of sugar and they’re in a house that feels cluttered and not peaceful, of course they have behavior issues. Why don’t we start with some of those simple things first and we might see their behavior get better and then we can see the real issues? I just think that for clinicians personally, and for their clients, this book is going to be so awesome.

Well, Allie, the last question I always ask is if every private practitioner in the world were listening right now, what would you want ’em to know?
[ALLIE]
Oh my gosh, that’s a really good question to spring on a person.
[JOE]
Usually I prep people, but because you’re such a close friend, I didn’t prep you. No, I just forgot to tell you before we started recording. So let you think on your feet about your last inspirational thing to my audience.
[ALLIE]
I’m processing. I feel like honestly, if every practitioner, oh my gosh, that’s so like what a beautiful thing too? How cool would that be? I feel like I would just want them to know like yes, to diving in deeper, yes to like really analyzing everything and finding deep answers, but also yes, to simple strategies that just make people feel lighter. It doesn’t take more than two seconds to Google the psych effects of removing clutter to see that it’s worth looking at, to see that it’s definitely a core problem. And our environment is affecting us so much. If you even just like declutter like your bathroom in your bedroom, just where you start and end of the day, what a huge difference for people, for yourself as a practitioner to really start the day and end the day in peace as you go, and you’re affecting other human minds?

It’s so huge. And for your patients and your clients like to be able to offer them like, “Hey, I know this is overwhelming and I see where you’re at. I see you. Let me give you something really simple to start with. Just don’t even, we don’t even need to work through all of this right now. Just go home and get rid of like two bags of stuff that is just weighing you down. It’s such a simple, practical thing to give somebody and it feels much more doable than diving deep into like the mess. And as somebody who is super into doing the inner work and healing and all of it, it can sometimes feel really heavy. And I think just how therapeutic and simple decluttering is, I just did it the other day and I felt a million times better and my issue wasn’t even my house. My issue was emotional. It’s just very therapeutic and I think it’s a really simple strategy to give a person that’s wanting to lighten their load, whether it’s physically or mentally and emotionally.
[JOE]
Oh my gosh. So amazing. If people want to get Declutter Like A Mother, where’s the best place for them to get it, how can they follow and just continue to be impacted by what you’re doing?
[ALLIE]
I actually have a page just for your listeners. If they just go to alliecasazza.com/joe, [J-O-E], you can preorder the book there or order it depending on when you’re listening. It comes out September 7th. I’m super excited. There’s also going to be like some book bonuses and like videos and things you can get for purchasing the book. And I would just love to support you. I would love to encourage you. I’d love to help you lighten your load and create space in your house that creates space for the life you really, really want and not wasting time on things that ultimately don’t matter. So go check it out and let me know what you think. Tag me on Instagram. I’d love to connect.
[JOE]
So awesome. Well, Allie, thank you so much for being on the Practice of the Practice podcast today.
[ALLIE]
Thank you so much for having me.
[JOE]
So make sure you go out there and get Declutter Like A Mother. While you’re out there on Amazon ordering it, pre-order Thursday is the New Friday. Do the double up there. We hope that you take action today. Declutter, go look at your stuff and say, “Do I even want this? What would it be like to not have all this stuff?? I’m even thinking about how we decluttered like a mother before we left, because we had renters moving into our full-time house. So it was all Airbnb ready level and I’m thinking what I’m going to evaluate when I go back into that house, what I’m bringing into the house. I’m going to enact what Allie said so that our house can stay feeling like a vacation rental instead of like a bomb goes off all the time. So I’m going to take some action as well when we return home.

Also, if you are at the point where you’re just so stink and busy, that you probably need to add a clinician or two, Group Practice Launch is the program for you. Over the next six months, Alison Pidgeon and Whitney Owens, who are two of the consultants here with Practice of the Practice, they both have mega group practices and also oversee Group Practice Boss, for the next months are going to be teaching you how to go from being a solopreneur to then being a group practice owner. So you can sign up for that or read more about that over at practiceofthepractice.com/grouppracticelaunch.

And thank you so much for letting me into your ears and into your brain. Have an amazing day. I’ll talk to you soon.

Special thanks to the band Silence is Sexy for your intro music. We really like it. And this podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter covered. This is given with the understanding that neither the host, the publisher, or the guests are rendering legal, accounting, clinical, or other professional information. If you want a professional, you should find one.