• Visit The Wisdom Portal, listen to Dr. Jennie’s podcast, and connect on Instagram.

 Joe Sanok 00:00:00  I'm so excited to introduce you to the best website designers out there. We have a brand new partnership with session sites. It is where good therapy meets brilliant design, and they get your website switched over or built in less than two weeks. They fine tune your messaging, use science backed user experience methodology, and work exclusively with mental health professionals. In fact, new clients right now are going to get three free therapy marketing strategy calls with their creative director of session sites. If you book today, you're not going to want to miss this. Head on over to session sites.com/joe again that session sites.com/joe get the website of your dreams today session sites.com/joe. This is the practice of the practice podcast with Joe Sano, session number 1146. I'm Joe Sanic, your host, and welcome to the practice of the Practice Podcast, this seven part series that kicked off back in episode 1141. Our consultant, ash, has been putting this together, talking about selling a practice. All that goes into it, all those things you need to think about.

Joe Sanok 00:01:25  today she's going to be talking to a friend of hers about her journey. And in our final session on the 31st, we'll be talking about envisioning your ideal practice sale. So an awesome series. Make sure you listen to the entire seven part series that kicked off back in 1141. Here we go.

Ashley Mielke 00:01:42  Welcome back to another exciting episode of The Practice of the Practice podcast. I'm your guest host, Ashley Mielke, and I'm really excited about our episode today. This is part six of our seven part series on how to sell a group practice. So all of the previous episodes have been focused on my journey of selling my group practice and really supporting you in preparing you when you're ready to exit your business, whether that's in the next couple of years or even ten years down the road. But today you are in for a treat. I know we've been talking about this the last couple of episodes. We have a very exciting guest on the podcast today. This incredible woman, Doctor Jenny Ward, is not only a colleague of mine, but a friend and someone who personally inspired me on my journey of selling my group practice.

Ashley Mielke 00:02:41  So she is going to be sharing just a wealth of knowledge and experience and insight to support you on your journey by sharing her story of selling her group practice in 2023. So before we dive in and we welcome Jenny to the to the podcast. I'm just going to share a bit of her bio and then we will dive right in. As the former owner of a successful group psychology practice in Alberta, Canada. Doctor Jenny Ward brings a wealth of real world business expertise to her role as a mentor and advisor over the course of her eight year ownership. She navigated the challenges of scaling and optimizing the practice, which ultimately led to a profitable sale in 2023. Now, doctor Ward shares the strategies and insights she gained through that process with other psychology group practice owners in Canada. Through her practice potential methodology, she guides and supports practice owners through the complex journey of selling their practices. She also runs a mastermind group, impeccable, for psychology leaders in Canada, who desire to accelerate their business growth along a curated group of peers in the industry.

Ashley Mielke 00:04:00  In addition to her work supporting psychology practice owners, doctor Ward works as a leadership mentor and spiritual guide, known for her ability to combine ancient wisdom with practical, modern business strategies to help leaders enhance their impact. And we are going to share at the end of this episode, how you can connect with Jenny Ward and how you can follow her on socials. So thank you so much for being here today, Jenny. Oh, what a wonderful introduction.

Jennie Ward 00:04:30  Ashley, I'm so happy to be here.

Ashley Mielke 00:04:32  Thank you. So I've got about a million questions for you because there's so much to unpack in the next 30 minutes. So we're just going to dive right in. So I thought a natural place for us to start, Jenny, to help our listeners understand a bit about your journey is to start at the beginning. So can you start by sharing how you got started with your practice? what your early goals were and what specialties or unique services you focused on.

Jennie Ward 00:05:02  Sure, absolutely. So I'll I'll rewind a little bit and go back to graduate school.

Jennie Ward 00:05:07  And when I was I did my PhD in clinical psychology here in Canada. And during my graduate training, I had planned on focusing on chronic health conditions. That was my goal. And so when I was finishing my residency and, you know, I was getting ready to graduate, I was working in an eating disorder program here in Alberta. And it was, you know, this beautiful multidisciplinary clinic. And it had all of these wonderful people working there. I really, really enjoyed it. And they had a job opportunity when I was graduating, and it was just a natural fit. You know, everything made sense for me to stay there. And at the same time, I had seen this job opportunity with the Canadian military. And for some reason, this this opportunity was really enticing me, and it really didn't make a lot of sense. It didn't really align with where I'd been planning to go in my career, but I just felt like I have to apply for this. And I applied and I got offers that both and what I ended up doing was going to work at the military clinic.

Jennie Ward 00:06:18  So I worked for five years for the Canadian Armed Forces as a contract psychologist. And the reason why I'm bringing this, this story up is, well, number one, it was really my my intuition that took me in that direction. And, you know, I'm definitely a very intuitively guided person, which I'm sure your listeners will find out. As I as we continue with this interview, I discovered that I had this passion for first responders and trauma and PTSD treatment. And when I started working at the military clinic. It was during the height of the Canadian involvement in the war in Afghanistan, so it was a very intense time. I absolutely loved it. And when I left that clinic and started my group practice, I went directly into a group practice ownership. I knew that that was my long term vision. And so I incorporated right away, and I called my practice ward and associates. But there were no associates at the beginning. It was just Ward. And that was the beginning of just a beautiful, specialty area of first responder PTSD treatment.

Ashley Mielke 00:07:32  Wow. Well, thank you for sharing the background of your story, Jenny. Can you can you let us know? How did you go from working for the military, specializing in trauma to then deciding, you know what, I'm actually going to branch out and start my own practice.

Jennie Ward 00:07:48  You know, I'm a very, business oriented, Head entrepreneurial person. And so I knew from the beginning of graduate school that ultimately I wanted to own my own practice, and that was something that I had in mind. And I knew I was working toward no matter what. But when I graduated from graduate school, it was pretty uncommon to go directly into private practice. It was more common to work at a clinic where, you know, you had colleagues around and you developed your skills a little further. So that was kind of the reason why I decided to to go that route. And I think that was helpful for me at the time. But ultimately, I knew I wanted to run my own practice from the get go.

Ashley Mielke 00:08:31  I love that, that's amazing. And so there you are. You are building and scaling up your practice. And then how far into your journey did you start to think about selling? Like, tell us a little bit about that and also the size of your practice at that time.

Jennie Ward 00:08:50  So the size of my practice, I believe there were ten clinicians at the time. I had two admin people working for me. so that was the the size of the the business. The decision to sell was an interesting one. So I did not plan on selling at all. And really, the when I made the decision to begin pursuing the sale, there were a few things that were happening in my life that led to that. I had been enjoying working for the practice for so long, and I really loved the business side, you know, optimizing systems and and the practice was thriving. I hadn't had a person leave the practice for four years. By the time I sold the practice, we had a really good culture.

Jennie Ward 00:09:40  I was very hands off with my admin, but I was finding that it was a bit more of a grind in some ways. You know, just the the shift in, group practice ownership. There were a lot more clinics opening. There were a lot more practitioners going into private practice. It was harder to recruit therapists. And, you know, it's just a bit of a challenge. It was not insurmountable by any means, but I was noticing that it was becoming a little bit harder. And so it was taking a bit more of my energy. And also at the same time, I was becoming deeply immersed in some of the other work that I do, which is more spiritual and energetic in nature. And I was apprenticing with a shaman, and I had been doing that for a number of years, and I was developing a new business, and I had incorporated a new business, the one that I'm working out of now, which is called the Wisdom Portal. And I was beginning to offer my signature methodology, the Mastery Paradigm, which is helping leaders to heal and grow and evolve using spiritual and energetic and intuitive methodologies.

Jennie Ward 00:10:55  So I was really being drawn in that direction. And so I was in mentorship with one of my mentors one day, and I was telling her about, you know, just kind of the struggle between running the group practice and, you know, all the things I had to do there and my new work in the wisdom portal. And, you know, I was talking to her about how I wanted to maybe hire more, more of a leadership team in the practice. And she said, you know, Jenny, have you ever thought about selling your group practice? And I was, you know, taken aback. I was I had not been thinking about that. And I said, no, absolutely not. That is not in my plan. That's not where I was going to go. But of course, that was just my initial response. And I said, you know, really, I hadn't been thinking about that, but I will give it some thought. So I took a couple of weeks to contemplate it, and I realized, you know, that seemed like a really great option for me at that point in my life.

Jennie Ward 00:11:55  So I decided to go for it.

Ashley Mielke 00:11:58  Wow, that is really incredible, Jenny, and thank you for sharing a bit about how there was a bit of that kind of, what am I trying to say? Like over overlapping of the group practice ownership and running your successful business, but also starting your new company, the Wisdom Portal. And so that seems it sounds like sort of a seamless transition for you in terms of what next steps would look like. So okay, so then you decide, you know what, this is actually going to be the right decision for me. What's the next step that you take in like early in that process.

Jennie Ward 00:12:37  Yeah. So then I discovered okay, I have no idea how to do this.

Ashley Mielke 00:12:42  So I had to start.

Jennie Ward 00:12:44  Doing some research and, you know, figuring it out. You know, I can be pretty scrappy. So I just buckled down and was like, okay, I'm going to figure out how to sell a business. And actually, you know, my husband, Brian, he is a corporate commercial lawyer.

Jennie Ward 00:13:00  And, you know, he's done all of my legal work for my group practice and for the sale. And so I had decided, okay, I figured out, you know, kind of the logistics of just the basics of how you sell a company. And then I decided, okay, I need to tell Brian that this is where I'm at. This is like really early on. And so he and I touched base and I had a conversation with him, and I was actually going to just ask him for a referral to another lawyer, because I actually didn't realize that he did sales of businesses because, you know, everything that he does is confidential. Everything that I do is confidential. So it was kind of funny. I said, Brian, do you know anyone who I could speak to about, you know, a sale of a business. And he's like, well, I do that almost every day. So. So that was kind of funny. I'm like, okay, apparently I should ask you more questions about what you're doing day to day.

Jennie Ward 00:14:00  So he was extremely helpful. And just, you know, all of the logistics and what I needed to do in order to set up my practice to sell and to take all of the steps that I needed to take.

Ashley Mielke 00:14:14  That is amazing. And by the way, I think I talked about Brian in previous episodes. he's just an amazing lawyer, and I felt so grateful for the opportunity to have his support in the sale of my business as well. So big shout out to Brian. Yes. so okay, so you're going to start this process. You've got Brian's support, you're ready to take those steps. Tell us about like, were there challenges or obstacles that you faced. Like what what did those next steps look like in terms of just even finding a buyer?

Jennie Ward 00:14:45  Yeah. So, you know, one of the biggest obstacles that I had at the beginning, and I don't know if you experienced this as well, but I didn't know anyone who had done this sort of process in Canada. And, you know, I was pretty tapped into the group practice world.

Jennie Ward 00:15:03  And I kept having these thoughts of, you know, if this was a thing, I feel like more people would do it. And so I had kind of this, you know, sort of a negative attitude to be honest about, like, I don't know if this is even possible because no one does this in Canada. And I wasn't sure if it was because, we have mostly contractor models here as opposed to in the States. You know, there is more of a tendency to have W2 employee based models. And so I knew that that would be more of a challenging selling feature. So that was, you know, I had a real mindset block there about, you know, I just don't know if this is going to work. But what I decided to do was I'm just going to keep plugging away and do what I need to do in order to make this happen. And if I hit a wall that I just can't get past, well, I guess that will be the end of it.

Jennie Ward 00:16:00  But you know, I'll just keep trying and see where it takes me. And you know, that attitude seemed to work and I was able to have a wonderful experience with the sale.

Ashley Mielke 00:16:10  It's amazing. I love that, and it's so true when we don't have any reference point on what steps to take, that can feel like a bit of a challenge or an obstacle. So thank you for sharing that. So then how did you secure your buyer? Like if for our for the the listeners on this episode, if they're going to consider where they would potentially find someone interested? I did I did talk about this in a previous episode. Different avenues to consider. But what like tell us about your journey.

Jennie Ward 00:16:42  Okay. Yes. So, you know, when it comes to finding a buyer, it's really interesting because everything is so confidential that it's not, you know, a matter of just putting word out there like, hey, I'm selling because, you know, that can cause a lot of disruption within your business if your staff know that you're selling.

Jennie Ward 00:17:00  So it's all kind of very quiet and underground. So that makes it even more challenging. So I tried a few different routes. You know, the whole process was, you know, just a learning experience. And so I did a few different things. I, I first reached out to someone that I knew that who I thought would be interested in buying. she's a wonderful person. I trust her, her business, you know, savvy. She's like a great therapist. I thought she'd be a wonderful choice. And so she and I were in talks for probably a good month, and she was trying to make it work. But for a number of reasons, she just couldn't make it happen. So that was disappointing. But you know, I had to kind of go back to the drawing board. And what I ended up doing was I decided to post anonymously in some Facebook groups where I just reached out and said, I'm looking to sell. And I gave like some very vague, like no one would know it was me.

Jennie Ward 00:18:03  But, you know, just some generic, comments around the practice and, you know, the success of the practice. And then I set up a confidential email account. So it was like, group practice sale at Canada, you know, dot com. It was just some, anonymous email and so people could reach out to me there, and then when they reached out to me, I would have them sign an NDA, a non-disclosure agreement. And then we were able to speak after that and speak more openly after they had signed the NDA. So that was ultimately how I found my buyer.

Ashley Mielke 00:18:42  Amazing. Thank you for sharing. So you find your buyer and now you have to prepare your practice for sale. What did that look like financially and operationally? And just even thinking about staff retention and those really key parts of your business.

Jennie Ward 00:18:59  Right. So, you know, as as it's probably clear now, I was not planning on doing this. So it was very, you know, from the time I had that discussion with my mentor until, you know, when I started taking steps to selling, that was like two weeks.

Jennie Ward 00:19:17  so, you know, I tend to be pretty, you know, I'm a fast action taker. so I really didn't do much when it came to changing my systems and processes. I but I was fortunate that my business was already set up really well. you know, I love the business side of things. So I had really good SOPs or, standard operating procedures. I had great admin support. My financials were in good shape, so when I decided to sell, my business was really ready for it. but I do, you know, for your listeners who are thinking about setting their practice up to sell, you know, buyers definitely want a turnkey experience, and they want to be able to step in and just take over. They want those SOPs. They want great documentation. They want evidence that you've been tracking KPIs or key performance indicators. They want multiple referral sources that are flowing well. They want excellent profit margins. So, you know, those are the areas that you want to focus on.

Jennie Ward 00:20:24  If you're wanting to kind of prepare your practice for a sale.

Ashley Mielke 00:20:29  I love that. Such great advice. What was the most unexpected part of the selling process for you?

Jennie Ward 00:20:38  You know, for me, I, I think I expected it to be pretty smooth. Which is naive of me now that I look back and and I expected it to be, you know, I'm pretty chill. I'm not a, I'm not a really, like, stressed out person all the time. But it was really, really stressful. And so I was I was not expecting it to be as stressful as it was. And, you know, there's a few reasons for that. One is, you know, you're doing all of your regular work, you know. So I was still running the group practice. I was still starting the wisdom portal and building that up. Plus you're doing the work of selling, which is, you know, that is a job in itself. There's a lot that goes into that whole process.

Jennie Ward 00:21:27  There's a lot of information to provide during the due diligence part of the sale. If you're not organized, you'll find out right away. You know, I was fairly organized, but it's still, you know, there were things that weren't, you know, in the places I hope they would be in. And, you know, when I had decided to sell, it was because I was having a little bit of a difficult time balancing everything that I had going on. So the sale itself actually made that worse temporarily before that got better. So that was pretty unexpected. the other thing that comes to mind is that I really struggled with the confidentiality of the sale, in that, you know, of course, as a psychologist, I'm used to things being confidential. And, you know, I'm like a vault, as I'm sure almost all of us are. but the idea of having this huge thing happening in my life and not being able to talk to very many people about it, you know, you have your advisers, and that's about it.

Jennie Ward 00:22:33  Thankfully, I had my husband, so he was very involved. I found that very stressful, and I almost felt as if I was lying to people, you know, they would ask me, oh, what's new? You know, what are you how's your business going? And I'd, you know, oh it's fine. Yeah. And I didn't want to, to talk any further because it felt like I was lying. so I hadn't really thought about how difficult that would be, but I found it challenging. I don't know if you felt the same way.

Ashley Mielke 00:22:59  Oh my gosh. Absolutely. That was by far the hardest part for me too, was feeling like I was being dishonest. And you have to almost separate that emotional part and recognize that this is a part of what it entails.

Jennie Ward 00:23:17  Yeah, it's a business transaction and the confidentiality is really important. Yeah.

Ashley Mielke 00:23:24  Yes.

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Ashley Mielke 00:24:28  Can you share a key lesson or take away from the negotiation stage of the sale of your business, Jenny.

Jennie Ward 00:24:36  Absolutely. So one of the things that my husband had emphasized to me was that everything is negotiable because I was often saying to him, you know, oh, I don't know if they'll agree to that or I don't know if that's going to work. And so he really encouraged me to give some thought to what are my non-negotiables.

Jennie Ward 00:24:57  And for me, the main one was I wanted a full cash deal, and I wanted the cash in hand in the day of the sale. So that was my non-negotiable and pretty much everything else I was pretty flexible on. I had other preferences, but I wasn't as concerned about those, so that really helped me to stay focused on what's the most important thing and how are we going to make this happen.

Ashley Mielke 00:25:24  Amazing. And tell us so we can understand your thought process. Why was that important to you like that? Non-negotiable. I want to have the cash. Just one lump sum payment in hand on the closing day.

Jennie Ward 00:25:36  Yeah. You know, that's a good question. I think it was probably because I had a bit of concern that, let's say something happened to the practice or, you know, I just know that things can go on where let's say their circumstances change and then they tell me, okay, I'm not going to pay you. And I didn't want to be in that position. I wanted to be able to make sure that I was receiving the amount that I wanted to receive for the sale, and I thought that it was more risky if I was having, you know, installments or, you know, the different types of payment methods that are out there.

Jennie Ward 00:26:14  I just didn't want that. So, yeah, it was just, probably a little bit of an anxiety based thing and a concern that maybe it wouldn't, you know, all come to fruition if I had to wait.

Ashley Mielke 00:26:25  Okay. That makes total sense. Thank you for sharing. Now that brings forth another question for me. How did you price the sale of your business? Like how did you come up with the number that you wanted?

Jennie Ward 00:26:40  Right. So in the very beginning stages, I, I researched, okay, how do you price a business and came you know, the EBITDA determination was, you know, the main recommendation for determining that. So I, I calculated my own EBITDA and I had an accountant as well. So but I wanted to have just kind of a general ballpark idea of what was my company worth. So I calculated my EBITDA. I came up with what I thought was a reasonable number for the practice, and it was probably, you know, you can have different multiples with the EBITDA number.

Jennie Ward 00:27:19  And I went with a bit of a lower multiple because I wanted the cash deal. And then I went to my husband that my lawyer and also to my accountant and spoke to them about, you know, this is the number that I had in mind. how does this look based on all of my financials? Because they had all my panels and all of that, and my my accountant was like, you know what? This seems spot on. this is what I would recommend. Absolutely. And that was actually the number that I got. So, yeah, I came up with it myself based on my own EBITA calculation, but I, you know, I made sure that it was, reasonable with the professionals. And. Yeah, that was the price that I ended up getting.

Ashley Mielke 00:28:04  That is amazing. Like, I am so happy for you, Jenny. Like, that is really incredible. Like you said, you really just trust your intuition. You also look at the data and you went for it and you got exactly what you wanted.

Ashley Mielke 00:28:18  That's amazing. So just briefly, for our listeners, because I have talked about this in previous episodes, but when they're looking at kind of preparing their business financially, what were the biggest numbers you were looking at was that net profit, profit margins, like just a quick snapshot of, you know, what our listeners need to consider when they go to sell their businesses.

Jennie Ward 00:28:43  Yeah. You know, really, you know, if you think about the the entire picture, if there's one number that is the most important when it comes to pricing, its profit, you know, annual profit. So how much money is in your pocket at the end of the year? That's really what the sale of a business is based on. and, you know, there's a whole bunch of other factors and, you know, growth and all of these other things. But, you know, in my opinion, what a buyer is looking at, you know, in how many years will I have paid off this, this deal, if the business keeps going at the same rate that it's going? and that's based on pure profit.

Ashley Mielke 00:29:25  Love that it's so simple. And I had I had mentioned in a previous episode that it's not about the scale of your company, so don't think you need to have ten locations and 100 therapists. It's what's more important is what is the profitability in your business. You can be a small but mighty and very profitable team, and that is going to be more desirable than the top line, right? Because you can make a lot right, a ton of money, but not be profiting at the end of the year. And so that doesn't benefit anyone.

Jennie Ward 00:29:55  Yeah, absolutely. I had a very profitable company. And so my company wasn't that big. But, you know, we were grossing more than a million a year and we had really good profit margins. And so that helped me to be able to sell for a very, you know, what I felt was a really good price.

Ashley Mielke 00:30:14  Amazing. So now, a big question that a lot of people have is how did you tell your team what did that look like?

Jennie Ward 00:30:23  Yes.

Jennie Ward 00:30:24  So, you know, I was very, very close with my team and I wanted to do this as respectfully as possible. however, I had, you know, people working all over. I had people living in different provinces still working for me. You know, they had moved, but they wanted to continue with the practice. So there was no way we were going to do an in-person meeting and even to have everyone on a call at the same time. That's almost impossible, right? Everybody has different things going on. And I had decided I was not going to say one word to anybody until the money from the sale was in the bank. And so and I didn't know what time that was going to happen on the day of the sale. Right. Because it's a bit unpredictable in terms of timing. So what I decided to do was record a zoom video of me letting them know about the sale and briefly about the reasons for my end. And as soon as the money was in the bank, all the documents were signed.

Jennie Ward 00:31:23  I sent that out to the entire team and I told them that they could send me a text when they received it, and when they were ready to talk about it, and that I would call them as soon as possible after that.

Ashley Mielke 00:31:36  Okay. Thank you for sharing that. And, you know, as much as you're comfortable sharing, what was the response from your team when they got that message?

Jennie Ward 00:31:47  You know, the response was mixed. You know, there were there were some people who were, you know, I'm so happy for you. And, you know, they all knew about my my shift in direction and how I was starting a new company. none of them knew I was going to sell, so that was a surprise to everyone. you know, some were crying. One person quit immediately. you know, it was a mixed bag. And, you know, one of the things that a friend of mine who is a very trusted, business savvy person, she had said to me before the sale, you know, there's no way that we're going to make everyone on your team be happy about this sale.

Jennie Ward 00:32:30  So don't even try to do that. You know, just communicate it neutrally. Know that you know this is right for you. And there was definitely, you know, a week or two of holding space for the team afterward and helping them to process their emotional response to the sale. Yeah.

Ashley Mielke 00:32:51  Thank you for sharing that. When you, shared this with me before, when I was getting ready to sell, your experiences were really comforting for me because that is something I was really afraid of. Was telling the team, letting them down, disappointing them, and I really had to take a step back and remind myself why. Why I was making this decision and why this was really the best situation for me given my, you know, life circumstances and, future desires. And, so I really went into that with just that mindset and also holding space and being compassionate for them, regardless of what their feelings were going to be. So thank you for that, Jenny.

Jennie Ward 00:33:37  Oh, you're very welcome.

Ashley Mielke 00:33:39  So looking back now, it's been some time.

Ashley Mielke 00:33:43  Is there anything you would have done differently?

Jennie Ward 00:33:47  Well, yes. So, you know, I think there are pros and cons to having your lawyer be your husband. And so Brian joked around that I was one of his worst ever clients because I would like, you know, argue with him or give him pushback about things, you know, that he would give me advice and I, you know, say, well, I don't agree with that. And so looking back, some of the things that I didn't listen to and he told me to do, I should have listened to him. one of them was that he had recommended. So I had a number of buyers who were interested And he told me, Jenny, have a bidding war, have a fast closing date. You know, whoever, whoever wins, wins. And you know that's the best way to do it. And you know, at the time I said to him, like, Brian, this isn't, you know, just like any old company, you know, my I'm really connected with my staff.

Jennie Ward 00:34:45  I wanted to have the perfect buyer. Right. And the person who I felt would be like the best steward of this business. And, you know, looking back, I actually think Brian was correct. because we really don't know how the the buyer is going to behave after they buy the practice anyway. you know, they can do their own thing and that's their prerogative. And so I think I was far too concerned about finding the perfect person. And I actually gave a lot of, I gave a lot of flexibility for what they wanted, which made the sale process harder on me. One of the things that I did was I said yes to a very long due diligence process. and so that was months, you know, months and months. And I should have, just listened to Brian and made that shorter, and it would have been less risky on my end and less stressful for me.

Ashley Mielke 00:35:45  Thank you. We appreciate just how open you've been about your journey, because I feel like this is going to be really helpful for people who are considering, selling their business and just really what the most important priorities are.

Jennie Ward 00:36:04  Yes, absolutely.

Ashley Mielke 00:36:05  So now you sell your practice. This, this era in your career is over. Tell us about the impact this sale had on your identity, like personally and professionally?

Jennie Ward 00:36:22  Yes, it was quite a shift, you know, I was very, very attached to my my identity as the owner of Warner Associates. You know, it was it was a huge part of who I was. And I think because I'm so passionate about my work, I, I spent a ton of time and energy on the business. So then when I stepped away from it and sold, you know, there was there was a bit of a void space there, that was previously filled with all of this energy and time that I was putting toward that. So, it took some time, you know, I thought, oh, this will take a couple months. And then after six months, I'm like, yeah, I still feel a little. I'm still kind of getting used to this. It took about a year, I think, to feel kind of more, you know, stabilized and aligned in my new identity.

Jennie Ward 00:37:15  And I'd been evolving a lot in my personal identity, you know, just in my, my work. I was moving into this different type of work, and so there was a lot of evolution happening. but it definitely it was a positive change. But even positive changes require adjustment.

Ashley Mielke 00:37:33  Yes. Thank you for sharing. And that's really reassuring to me, having been out of my cell for less than two months. Right. And really just giving myself that space to feel all my feelings, and in many ways it feels like a death.

Jennie Ward 00:37:48  In my life. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm a big fan of living in a cyclical way. And so really the the process of kind of letting go of our companies, that is like the winter season, that void season. And that's where there's a lot of, you know, quiet. It looks like nothing's happening. But actually there's you know, there's a lot of recalibration happening behind the scenes.

Ashley Mielke 00:38:14  Oh, it's beautiful. Beautiful. So tell us more about the wonderful, incredible work that you're doing now.

Jennie Ward 00:38:24  Yes. So, you know, after I sold, I actually planned on just doing the mastery paradigm, my signature methodology for for leaders. That was my plan. And what what ended up happening was word was getting out that I had sold, and I was getting a lot of questions from other group practice owners, like, how did you sell? What are the steps? Which I totally understood because I didn't know how to do it either. So I developed a process, and I have a master class on the steps about how to sell your practice. So it's called Practice Potential the Art of selling your Canadian Group practice. So I've been doing some talks on practice potential, and I'm selling this master class. And then I offer one on one mentorship for people who are looking to sell their practice, because it's one thing to know what the steps are, but it's a Very tumultuous process, and so helping people with logistical support and guidance and help with implementing things and even emotional support from someone who really understands the process.

Jennie Ward 00:39:33  So that's been kind of one piece of what I'm up to. Then sorry. Go ahead.

Ashley Mielke 00:39:40  Yeah, you go ahead. I love listening.

Jennie Ward 00:39:44  So I also I've always worked quite a bit with therapists. So I was kind of a therapist for therapists. And you know, I was always falling into I'm a natural business coach. you know, a lot of my therapists were in private practice or group practice owners, and so they were coming to me for like, therapy. But really we were doing business coaching, and I had some people asking me to do business coaching for them, some therapists. So I decided to start a mastermind group called impeccable, which is a business coaching group for leaders in the psychology world in Canada. So it's mostly group practice owners, but also owners of collective spaces and those who rent space to people supervisors. So it's to help these therapists to achieve their business goals and also have harmony in their their life. So to have a personal life at the same time. So it's definitely not a hustle mentality.

Jennie Ward 00:40:45  It's it's a very beautiful, kind of harmonious type of group. And this is I'm running the second round of impeccable right now. And yeah, it's just getting better and better.

Ashley Mielke 00:40:56  Oh my gosh, this is just incredible. Jenny. the work that the work you're doing, how you support other therapists across Canada and group practice owners and just being that that anchor for them. Like, I really feel like I could have used these services with you. Well, and thank God you were there for me when I was, you know, just needing a bit of encouragement because it is so much more stressful and emotional of a process than even I anticipated. So thank you for your good work. Now, for our listeners. If they wanted to work with you, they wanted to connect with you, how would they find you?

Jennie Ward 00:41:35  So you can find me on Instagram? I'm at the wisdom portal or on LinkedIn. I'm Doctor Jenny Ward, Jenny with an eye and you can check me out at my website, The Wisdom Portal.

Jennie Ward 00:41:49  Okay.

Ashley Mielke 00:41:50  Beautiful. Now, we do like to wrap up episodes when we have amazing guests on like yourself, with just kind of a word of encouragement, a message that you'd like to give to the the group practice owners that are listening today.

Jennie Ward 00:42:08  Yes. Well, you know, the message that I think is most helpful to hear, it's the message that I really needed to hear when I was starting my journey of selling, which is that it's absolutely possible, whether it's right now, you know, maybe you're ready right now, or maybe you have to take some steps to get your practice ready to sell. But it's absolutely possible, and it's very beneficial to have support and selling. You know, it doesn't have to be me, but to have, you know, a mentor or a guide who can help you through the process, it would be really, really challenging to do it without that.

Ashley Mielke 00:42:45  Thank you so much, Jenny. It has been such a pleasure and privilege having this conversation with you today, and I know our listeners on the practice of the practice podcast are going to walk away with so much value.

Ashley Mielke 00:43:00  So thank you again for your time.

Jennie Ward 00:43:02  Yes. Thank you so much for having me, Ashley. It's been an absolute pleasure.

Ashley Mielke 00:43:07  Thank you so much for joining us today for part six of our seven part series, and I look forward to seeing you in our last episode.

Joe Sanok 00:43:24  We are so excited to bring these types of things to you as much as we can, so that you can level up your practice in a way that's just amazing. Head on over to Alma's website. Hello Alma Comigo, if you want help with credentialing, if you want help, reimbursement rates and the guaranteed two week payback again, that's hello alma.com/jo. Thank you for letting me into your ears and into your brain. Have a great day. I'll talk to you soon. Special thanks to the band Silence is sexy for that intro music, and this podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter covered. It is given with the understanding that neither the host, the producers, the publishers or guests are rendering legal, accounting, clinical or other professional information.

Joe Sanok 00:44:10  If you want a professional, you should find one.