Joe Sanok 00:00:00 You’re someone with a vision for your practice, for your side hustle, and for your personal journey. But when it comes to establishing your path and how to get to where you want to be with your practice, things get a little messy. You’re also someone who would prefer to go in person instead of to groups and listening to everyone else’s story. To me, it sounds like you could benefit from one on one consulting with our experienced practice of the practice consultants from 595 a month and up, you can work with a consultant that will give you more direction and practical, tried and tested tips matched to you and your goals. For more information, visit practice of the practice. Com forward slash apply. Again, that’s practice of the practice. Com forward slash apply. This is the practice of the practice podcast with Joe Sarna session number 1019. I’m Joe Stanek, your host, and welcome to the practice of the Practice Podcast. I want you to think back to when you first started your practice, and maybe you haven’t even started it. Joe Sanok 00:01:15 Maybe you’re listening to this thinking, man, I think maybe I want to start a practice. I work full time at CMH or a nonprofit, and I need some extra money, or I want to eventually leave. Or maybe you’re, you know, home and you’ve dedicated time to your family or your kids, and you’re saying, you know, I think I want to get back into the field a little bit, but those of you that have a practice, I want you to think back to that beginning. I remember for myself when I started mental wellness counseling, I was working full time at a, I was a foster care supervisor. I was really stressed out by it. I remember I had this eye twitch that started, and I have never had an eye twitch. and, you know, I started this side gig counseling practice seeing just, you know, 3 to 6 people a week on Mondays and Wednesdays. And then, you know, things switched to my schedule where I switched it to Tuesdays and Thursdays. Joe Sanok 00:02:05 And then there was a lot of stuff I didn’t know. I didn’t know how to do a website. I didn’t know about Psychology Today. I didn’t know how people would even find you. And so I was so much just starting from scratch. I didn’t know up from down. It was really just talking to local therapists that were nice enough to share with me. If I bought them a cup of coffee, what they did. And that phase has so much uncertainty, so much lack of knowledge, that whole kind of paradigm of you don’t know what you don’t even know. Then you move into, you know what you don’t know, and then you don’t know what you actually know. And then, oh, you know what? You know, that idea of not even knowing where to start for me was just such a pronounced area. At the time, there were no podcasts about private practice. There were very few blogs that were out there. and so I’m really excited today to bring you, one of my consulting clients, Maria Elliot, who opened a practice in Ohio in fall of 2023 after heading back to work once her four children were in school full time. Joe Sanok 00:03:07 she’s loving working again with clients, being creative with starting her business her way and learn something new every day. She hopes to inspire other therapists to really listen to their hopes and dreams for their work and practice, and to work and be patient as those become reality. Maria, I am so excited to have you on the practice of the Practice podcast. Maria Elliott 00:03:27 Hi Joe. I’m happy to be here and chatting with you. Joe Sanok 00:03:30 Yeah, you know, it was at the time of this recording about a year ago that you reached out well before the fall when you wanted to launch your practice. And I want to go back to maybe early 2023 before you and I started working together. What did your life look like? Where you were saying to yourself, you know, I think I want to start a counseling practice. Maria Elliott 00:03:50 So it was just the beginning of the year, you know, new year, new resolutions, New, just hopes and dreams. And I sat down with my husband and we were talking. You know, the plan was always for me to go back to work. Maria Elliott 00:04:05 I early in my counseling career, I worked in community mental health and then transitioned to a private practice full time and then moved into more of a part time position because we began, you know, starting our family. And I had one child and then two, and then the third came along and it just, you know, with our family life, it just didn’t make sense for me to work outside the home full time, during that period. So I did step away, kept up my license, but with, with understanding and agreement with my husband and I that eventually, when the time was right, would head back into the field because I loved counseling, I loved working with people. I just loved that piece of my life. So I stayed home, for about ten years. And then, at the beginning of last year, realized, oh, my last, child, my son, he was five at the time. I knew he would be moving into kindergarten the following year full time. So that meant all four of my children would be in school full time. Maria Elliott 00:05:14 you know, I thought I would take a year to just recoup our family life and get organized, but, the more I just thought of it and, discerned that and talked with my family that it was the right time. So, really just made that decision to begin looking into. How would I even begin to start a private practice? so that’s what the thought process was. Joe Sanok 00:05:40 Now, I’m wondering, you know, in that kind of early year when you’re thinking about this, it’s almost like that pre contemplation like this could be something I’m not sure if I want to do it. I’m figuring it out. What were helpful resources Sources, podcasts, things you read that that helped you kind of see what that project of starting a practice would look like. And maybe you maybe you didn’t do a ton of research. You just knew you wanted to do it. But how did you decide from maybe I could start a practice to like, yeah, I’m ready to go. Maria Elliott 00:06:08 So I was listening to a lot of different podcasts at the time. Maria Elliott 00:06:12 One was practice of the practice and was just very inspired. Every time I would listen to it and just listening made it, feel doable. like there were steps that I could follow. I looked on the website as well and just felt encouraged. And then I just was listening to some other podcasts too, not even in the starting private practice field. More just, you know, psychological healing and, body, mind and spirit wellness. And so I was listening to all of those things at the same time, but just kept sort of coming back to and being inspired by starting my own practice with the practice of the practice. So again, you know, sat down, really thought about, discussed with my family and thought, okay, I really feel like this is the time to start it, but because of my family life, because, you know, with four children, with my husband who travels quite a bit, I had to still be sort of the my primary vocation was still at home, and running the family. Maria Elliott 00:07:16 So I thought, if I’m supposed to or if I want to run this private practice, but also be sort of primary caregiver and runner of this family, how how do those two things come together? And I thought, I just need to ask for help. so I did, you know, talk with you, Joe. And we talked about all the different options. And I thought, what is the best and easiest way this season of my life to get sort of what I, what I think I’m supposed to be doing, starting this private practice. And the easiest way to do that, the most efficient, The most thorough, was to do private consulting with you, so that’s what I decided to do. Joe Sanok 00:07:57 now, I know initially you’re kind of in this spring of 23. You were thinking, you know, maybe you wanted to launch in the summer, maybe you wanted to get things kind of rolling. And then, you ended up landing on October. I want to, because. Because as consulting clients go, you had probably one of the most clear visions for what you wanted for your family. Joe Sanok 00:08:19 I think a lot of people struggle with, oh, I should be making money for my family, and I should be working, and I want to be a good mom. And. And they’re kind of like, hem and haw and feel like they have their kind of fingers in everything, and then everything gets just half of them. Whereas you have such clarity around, like, this is who I want to be in my family. This is how I want to show up in my relationships. This is how I want to show up outside of my relationships. You know, you mentioned that mind, body, spirit. I feel like you really have a strong vision of what you want for for yourself. Can you speak a little bit to that? Maria Elliott 00:08:53 Sure. I think it’s my personality to really be reflective and introspective. I think maybe the ten years that I had at home. sort of full time with my family, with my kids, helped me, or I guess, gave me the space and the time to really know myself and know my situation. Maria Elliott 00:09:16 and know my seasons. So I guess the three S’s know myself, know the situation, and know the season of life that I am in right now. And, I just know I’m a better person when I’m able to honor all of those those pieces my myself, but also my family, my friendships, my own wellness, but then also my professional vocational, piece as well. So it’s almost like a compartmentalize. And I had I had it sort of inklings the year before that this was maybe going to come to be. So I almost practiced. my son was in preschool like three full days a week, but then he was home with me two days, and I spent a lot of time with him. But then I started to, actually send him to, to, a friend’s house, and then we would switch off, off and on. But I would send him to a friend’s house and use that day. Not for chores, not for, you know, anything else around the house or family related. Maria Elliott 00:10:24 But I was using it as my work day, my quote unquote work day. just to almost practice and see if this could really work, where I was able to compartmentalize and have a day for work, and then also have, you know, accomplish all of the other pieces of my life. And it worked. It flowed. It felt great. so I tuned in to that and that probably informed then some of those decisions the early next year or last year. so I just think it’s really important to know your limits, but then just to know yourself and your situation and your season and then make work as one of those pieces fit in with all of that because I don’t think it’s sustainable. If if you aren’t quite sure how it’s all going to fit together. Joe Sanok 00:11:16 yeah. Yeah. And so what was the benefit of I think a lot of people would say, well, then I should have delayed consulting until October if that’s when I want to launch. What was the benefit for you of still doing consulting and working on the practice? And there’s people that are going to listen that that never do consulting and they’ll never do next level practice. Joe Sanok 00:11:35 So I want to make sure they get value and not just like go do consulting with Joe. yeah. Or our team. But what was the value just in general of working on the practice in those months. In the summertime, when you’re clearly focusing also on your kids, you’re focusing on all the summertime stuff. But to to put in that time, like to have such a long runway, maybe that’s my real question. Like what was the value in having a long runway leading to October? Maria Elliott 00:12:01 Oh yeah. And I would not do it any other way. I think the value was to plan very, very well. I don’t have time in my life, to like, figure it out as I go. And I knew I would be like, because I have an office outside the home, I don’t just do telehealth. So I knew I wanted to pay rent. I knew I needed help in certain areas, like with taxes. And so I knew that there were going to be bills to pay. Maria Elliott 00:12:30 I didn’t want to start paying bills and then not have a practice ready to go to pay those bills, if that makes sense. So the long time frame allowed me to just set up a really strong framework. and plan and vision for the practice. Well, first, probably to understand what my vision was with the practice, with someone else’s help and then to develop a plan, but then actually set up the framework to implement that vision and plan. Without that, I again, using that sustainability, word I don’t think I would walk into then October, opening my doors and beginning to see clients feeling confident that, you know, this, this practice is to sustainable and is is a long term, you know, thing, if that makes sense. Yeah. Joe Sanok 00:13:29 Now, if you were to kind of say, the phases, in leading up to your launch, you know, were there like kind of three distinct phases, five like, what were some of the big steps or big things that you needed to accomplish before you really start taking on clients? Maria Elliott 00:13:44 I think the first was really just that vision. Maria Elliott 00:13:48 and the dream of like, okay, I want to start a private practice, but what does that actually look like? Like. And you really helped sort of with that ideal client. Right. So who? I could just open my doors and let whoever walks through the door come in and, you know, we all do that. and I wanted to really, you know, be specific in who I wanted to serve and who I wanted to help. So I think the first phase was just the dream and the vision, of what, what I wanted it to look like. And then maybe step two was just really developing that plan, like, okay, well, here are the steps. Here are the things that need to be in place. I need, a website, I need like a budget, I need, the whole social media piece. So just laying out what that plan was and needed to be was really helpful. And again, asking for help, having someone just walk you through that so you don’t get off track. Maria Elliott 00:14:52 And then third is really just doing the work to making that framework come, come to fruition. So actually making the website and keep keep revisiting it. And is it what I want it to be, you know, developing a social media presence early on, even though I was my doors were not open getting my name out there. let’s see just all those little framework pieces, almost the structure that allowed, the practice to happen, finding a space, you know, maybe not signing the lease, but just beginning to look around and talk with people, with other counselors. The networking piece was really huge, you know, talking with physicians around town with schools, with churches. With other counselors. And just getting my name out here and saying, hey, you know, come October, if you’re looking for a place to refer clients, if you’re filling up or this isn’t your specialty, know that I’m going to be opening my doors. So I, I think the the lead up to was crucial to feeling confident come October when I actually opened the doors. Maria Elliott 00:16:05 But then having, having clients actually walk through the door. Joe Sanok 00:16:20 I am so excited about alma. When I had my private practice, I struggled building my caseload, attracting the right clients, managing the business side. And honestly, one of the reasons I didn’t take insurance was it was so difficult to navigate. So many of my consulting clients deal with these problems as well, and almost supports clinicians in building rewarding private practices with simplified insurance credentialing in under 45 days, enhanced reimbursement rates, and guaranteed two week payback, plus a free profile in their searchable filter directory, making it easy for clients who are the right fit for your practice to find you. Learn more about how alma could support your private practice at. Hello, alma. Com forward slash Jo. That’s hello alma.com/joe to learn more. Now I want to go back to kind of your business avatar. Your ideal client. how did that shift for you? Like, you know, where did you start? And then kind of where did you land in regards to figuring out who you really wanted to attract to your practice? Maria Elliott 00:17:30 I think I started and landed the same place. Maria Elliott 00:17:32 I see women, I see a lot of moms, you know, middle aged to young adult women who just really are struggling really want to, not just survive, but thrive through all the ups and downs of life. I also see, adolescents and children. There’s quite a vacuum here in central Ohio for openings for children to receive mental health services, sadly. And there’s such a need. And that is the population I worked with previous to taking that those ten years off. So and one that I’m really passionate about. And I had a lot of real life experience with the past ten years. So, even though, like my ideal client was the, the mom, the woman that’s really struggling just with life. But then also, I think I really have that passion for working with kids as well. Now, that said, I did sort of land on that and that’s where my client base really has landed. Now that my doors are open. But I would recommend that it’s important to make like have that vision of the ideal client. Maria Elliott 00:18:46 But then I think you have to be open to the surprise of the practice too. You almost have to be open to, you know, the practice is going to go where it’s supposed to go if you use that time to plan and have that vision and then build that strong framework. Like our doors are open because we love to help people, and that’s just who we all are as counselors. So whoever is going to walk through that door is who we’re supposed to help and where the practice is supposed to go. And and there’s that. Then fluidity. Once you do open your doors, you’ll know, where you need to take the practice. You’ll know and get a sense and a flow of where you need to maybe go explore more training or certifications, like, I think having the idea of the ideal client is important and be open to other other clients as well, and where that may shape, you know, the practice. Joe Sanok 00:19:45 So October comes around. It’s time to open your doors, start seeing your first clients. Joe Sanok 00:19:49 What was harder than you expected and what was easier and what you expected. Maria Elliott 00:19:55 So I think the biggest struggle come October was, you know, opening my doors and then no one was walking through the door, so expecting and getting pumped up to have all these clients hearing in the community that there’s such a lack of opportunity and open appointments for people, and then no one was calling me or emailing me or walking through my door. So I began to panic. but looking back at it, now that I have, you know, a base of clients, I think I just needed to trust the process. It takes a while for for the name to get out. It takes a while for people to trust you and a new practice. And then people’s lives are just busy. So, I think I just looking back, that was a much harder struggle. but what I did that maybe worked was just being patient, trusting the process and staying the course. Joe Sanok 00:20:51 I love that. then, you know, as you think about kind of the time since October. Joe Sanok 00:20:57 So at the time of this recording, it’s almost May, and I know this will go live in July. So about six months of having this practice open. what have you learned over those six months? What do you think really helped you get to year round? I think ten clients or so. What helped you get to ten clients? What would you recommend, in regards to what really worked during that six months? Maria Elliott 00:21:23 I think talking to people, I think getting the name out, getting my name out, maybe not always. Like thinking outside the box. So a lot of my referrals have come through pastors of churches. A lot of my referrals have come through primary care doctors that I just know. so I think thinking outside the box, about connecting with people and then word of mouth is, is really how people gain trust in counseling and then a specific practice and counselor. So, you know, continuing to if I’m asked to talk somewhere, definitely go talk. And if I’m asked, you know, to do a little workshop, jump on that just to get the name out there and then do good work. Maria Elliott 00:22:22 I think, again, it’s that word of mouth. So I’m using a lot of my downtime now. Yes, to build the practice but also build myself up as a counselor. like I said earlier, you have to trust that who comes through your doors, who’s supposed to be there? And I’ve had this whole, you know, group of clients come through, with some trauma. So I update and, you know, I’m using that extra time to really update myself, become certified in, and become more of an expert on trauma. So just getting yourself, your name out there, but then bettering yourself for those clients that are coming through the door. Joe Sanok 00:23:03 Now I want to dig into that word of mouth. I think that’s an area a lot of people struggle with where they say, like, how do I authentically build word of mouth? Because, you know, word of mouth is usually people just trusting you, knowing you. It’s very organic. But then if you’re saying my goal is to help people refer to me, it feels like I don’t want to take someone out just to like, use them to get referrals. Joe Sanok 00:23:23 So how how do you feel like you have authentically built that word of mouth? Maria Elliott 00:23:30 Well, I’m an introvert, so cold calling people and taking them to coffee is not my jam. even though it works for a lot of people, and it’s actually probably a really great way to get your name out there. But I know myself, and I know that doesn’t work for me. so I do quite a bit of mailings. I, you know, create a mailing, and then send it with a personal letter to, like a doctor I know or a pastor I know or a teacher that I know. A principal, a school principal. I knew a few, like, women’s conferences that were happening that I was connected with here in the central Ohio area. so I bought an ad in their program, and again, put, put my QR code, put my name, put my picture. All of my contact information in this program in a couple programs, just again, to get my name out there. Maria Elliott 00:24:35 so knowing your population that you really want to it to get with women and children and families in my case, and then targeting those places where you and then getting your face, your name, in your contact information in their hands. Joe Sanok 00:24:54 So how are you thinking about the future? So you’re at around ten clients, and, the practice is growing. It’s a young practice. Like when you think about the next six months or a year, how do you conceptualize those goals? What’s next? Maria Elliott 00:25:08 Well, again, right, it’s end of April, almost May. I have to look at myself and my situation and my season. It’s summer is coming. I have to be real, real, real, and truthful with myself about what the next three months hold. And that means summer break. And I’ll have four children at home. So, you know, I’ve been planning for and working through even just the finances and how I’m going to shift my schedule so that I bounce down to fewer days a week. So, right now I just being real honest with, with myself in situation. Maria Elliott 00:25:46 And so, I’m just going to stay the course. You know, usually I would be trying to grow the practice or do more workshops or groups or something like that. But I just know the next three months, I just have to stay the course and see the clients and, and really give my best self to the clients that I currently have come fall. I’m really excited to begin to grow again, and I’ll have you know that good chunk of time, nine months to continue to just, continue to grow. I really, again, am listening to myself and the needs of my clients. So I’ll continue with the individual therapy, but I’m experimenting with and thinking about offering some workshops to to young moms and families. I’m thinking of doing a bit more writing, because sometimes people can always come through the door. And really the hope is just to help people. So blogging more, doing some even some books or newsletters for those clients that may need help but not able to come through the door. Joe Sanok 00:26:53 I love it. Joe Sanok 00:26:54 You’re thinking about that already? one thing we often talk about is the the sandwich approach, where therapy is kind of the middle of the sandwich. But then what can you do for people before they’re ready for therapy? You know, what kind of courses can you have? Self-Assessments, even blog post retreats. And then what can you have after therapy? When people graduate, they’re feeling better. They want to, you know, keep connecting with their partner. They want to keep connecting with themselves. Like, you know, what kind of retreats or services can you have or membership communities can have after that? So I love that you’re already thinking about that stuff. Maria. The last question I always ask is if every private practitioner in the world were listening right now, what would you want them to know? Maria Elliott 00:27:32 I would say do it. I would want them to know that they can do this, and to trust themself. I think trust is the big word here, to trust themselves that they know what they’re doing. Maria Elliott 00:27:46 And if they don’t know what they’re doing in one specific area, that they can ask for help. And it’s important to ask for help. Not any counselor, not any individual can can create this private practice on their own. You have to ask for help, whatever that is, developing the practice, or just with the finances or with the taxes or with social media. So trust yourself that you can do it with help and then just to trust the process. Yes. it’s important to have just such a strong vision and plan and framework And trust the process that it will ebb and flow as well. And that’s what’s supposed to happen to make it. You know, practices are not like, I don’t know, black and white. There’s they’re much more colorful. And we have to allow that, that flow to happen. Joe Sanok 00:28:39 So awesome. Well, Maria, if people want to connect with you, where should we send them? Maria Elliott 00:28:45 Yeah. Well, my website is Vera wellness.com via Tribus Wellness. Dot com means strength in Latin, by the way. Maria Elliott 00:28:57 And, I’m also on Instagram and Facebook. I think that’s it. Joe Sanok 00:29:04 So awesome. Well, thank you for being on the practice of the practice podcast. Maria Elliott 00:29:08 Thank you Joe. And. Joe Sanok 00:29:17 You know, it’s always so fun to watch someone go through their journey? and, you know, whether it’s in next level practice or people that, you know, listen to this show or do consulting with me or one of the consultants, it’s really just amazing to see someone go from, hey, I want to do this. what do I do next to not having ten clients? I mean, ten clients is a game changer for a family and for a budget and for your community. I mean, think about, you know, just ten more people’s lives being touched in so many different ways. you know, if you’re looking for consulting, we have a team of consultants that can help you at every phase of practice. we have consultants that help you with mega practices that help you switch from 1099 to W-2s. We have consultants that help you get book deals and build podcasts and build passive income, all sorts of different things. Joe Sanok 00:30:06 So if you’re interested in just reading more about our consultants and what they do, working with myself or any of the other consultants that we have on the team, just head on over to practice of the practice. Com forward slash apply. I meet with every single person that applies to just talk about what’s your return on investment you’re looking for from consulting? How are you judging whether or not you actually get what you want at the end of six months or nine months of consulting? We want to know where you’re going to land. We run numbers together so that we can know, okay, is this actually going to help you? is this realistic? Based on what we know from helping thousands of people start growing, scale their private practices, and then, you know, we have 10 to 15 people a week or so that are meeting with. So we don’t have to squeeze you into anything you don’t need. So we can say, here’s here’s the recommendation, if it’s a fit, awesome. If not, then that’s totally cool too. Joe Sanok 00:30:56 so we really go into it saying, we want to join you in your practice, and come alongside as a guide, as a colleague, as someone that can just help you speed things up. So if that sounds good, head on over to practice. practice.com/apply. Also, we could not do the show without our amazing sponsors. Almah is our sponsor today. And you know going in network with insurance can be really tough. You’re filling out the right paperwork. It can be time consuming. It can be tedious. And when you join Alma’s insurance program, you can see clients in your state of licensure, regardless of where you’re working from. I mean, I don’t know about you, but I like traveling. And so maybe you want to travel outside your state for a bit. You can still see those people. You can learn more about building a thriving private practice with alma over at hello alma.com/jo again. That’s hello alma.com/jo to get started. Thank you so much for letting me into your ears and into your brain. Joe Sanok 00:31:52 Have a great day. I’ll talk to you soon. Special thanks to the band Silences Sexy for that intro music. And this podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter covered. It is given with the understanding that neither the host, the producers, the publishers or guests are rendering legal, accounting, clinical or other professional information. If you want a professional, you should find one.