Joe Sanok 00:00:00 You’re someone with a vision for your practice, for your side hustle, and for your personal journey. But when it comes to establishing your path and how to get to where you want to be with your practice, things get a little messy. You’re also someone who’d prefer to go in person instead of to groups and listening to everyone else’s story. To me, it sounds like you could benefit from one on one consulting with our experienced practice of the practice consultants from 595 a month and up. You can work with a consultant that will give you more direction and practical, tried and tested tips matched to you and your goals. For more information, visit practice of the practice. Com forward slash apply. Again, that’s practice of the practice. Com forward slash apply. This is the practice of the practice podcast with Joe Sarna. Session number 1006. I’m Joe Santos, you’re hosting. Welcome to the practice of the practice podcast. We cover all things private practice here so that you can have a thriving private practice you absolutely love. Joe Sanok 00:01:16 We want that side of thriving because oftentimes in grad school, where we’re taught to think like martyrs, that, you know, we’re not in it for the money and you’re bad if you’re making money and we want you to thrive. We want this to be something that impacts you, impacts your staff, impacts your community, but also that you absolutely love it, that you don’t feel sleazy or slimy when you’re doing marketing around your practice, but instead you’re just excited about what you’re creating and what you have created. And then it just aligns with how you want to run a business. So we talk about all things private practice 3 or 4 days a week, depending on how we’re doing and if we want to do 3 or 4 episodes in a week. So really excited to have our guest today, Kevin Chamberlin is a podcaster who is also a podcast coach. His first podcast, Phile, who was launched in 2018 as a side hustle while he was a corporate software developer, and just months after launching the show, he decided to leave his 9 to 5 and go all in on podcasting. Joe Sanok 00:02:14 Within 18 months, Phile, who surpassed 100,000 downloads and more than $140 in monetized revenue. In 2020, Kevin began helping other podcasters grow and monetize their shows as well. He launched Grow the Show a podcast and the Grow the Show Accelerator and Intensive Podcast Accelerator program. In just two years to Grow the Show podcast has amassed an audience of 30,000 plus and the Grow the Show Accelerator has served over 350 podcasters, generating multi seven figures in revenue. Kevin’s mission now is to help as many independent podcasters turn their shows into profitable businesses, as much as he possibly can. Welcome to the show. Kevin Chemidlin 00:02:56 Joe. It’s so awesome to be here. Thank you so, so much for having me. Joe Sanok 00:03:00 Yeah, I always love having other podcasters, especially when we’re talking podcasting on a podcast. we haven’t done a show like this in a while. when you first started Philly, who, Why did you start it? Kevin Chemidlin 00:03:13 Yeah. So I was, and still am super passionate about my hometown of Philadelphia. And, you know, it was 2017 was 2017 was when I discovered podcasting as a listener. Kevin Chemidlin 00:03:25 And, you know, I just crushed shows that interviewed successful people, entrepreneurs, those types of things. And there was one day where I was listening to an incredible podcast. It’s called how I Built This with Guy raz. A lot of people have heard of it. I love that show. And in that, yeah, an unbelievable episode. and our unbelievable show and the episode that I was listening to was about Warby Parker. So the glasses brand and I didn’t know it at the time, but Warby Parker was founded in Philly, and so I just was like, I don’t know, man. I was just so into hearing that successful Philadelphia story. And then immediately when the episode was over, I was like, okay, I need more of this. Let me go find a, you know, there’s got to be a podcast out there that does this for successive Philadelphians, like, tells their story in a very cinematic way. And I searched around and it didn’t exist. And so that’s kind of when the bug got, you know, the idea got planted in my head where I was like, maybe, maybe I could make something like that. Kevin Chemidlin 00:04:18 and, you know, six months later, Philly, who launched so kind of yada yada over the launch process. But that’s how I got started in it. I totally didn’t expect podcasting to become my thing. I thought it was going to be like a little side project. but really quickly I discovered that I was way more passionate about, podcasting and Philly than I was, you know, writing insurance software, which is what I was doing at the time. and that’s how it all got started. No. Joe Sanok 00:04:43 How have you grown as a podcaster over the years? I know when I go back and sometimes I’ll do this at conferences. I’ll play a couple of my first shows because they’re just so cringe worthy. And, you can tell that I have this sense of like, I shouldn’t be here and having to prove myself. And I’ve done this and I’ve done this and, it’s just like I listen to it now, and I feel so inauthentic. But you got to start somewhere. How have you grown personally as a podcaster? over the years? Kevin Chemidlin 00:05:09 Yeah. Kevin Chemidlin 00:05:09 I mean, the first thing that comes to mind is, is kind of similar, where in the very early days, I tried to remove myself as the host, as much as I possibly could. So I didn’t say anything about my background or who I was. You know, I just you would listen to an initial episode of the Philly show and I would be like, my name is Kevin Smith in today’s guest, blah, blah, blah, blah. And we were just the whole episode would be about the guest. And, you know, that did serve me well at first, that I just made it all about them because it made it a great show. but it wasn’t too long until I started getting actually, I got reviews in Apple Podcasts where people were saying like, who is this Kevin guy? Like, why? I can’t find him online. Like, who is this guy? Why did he make this podcast? We want to know more about him. and so I saw those reviews and I was like, that’s weird. Kevin Chemidlin 00:05:53 People want to know more about me. That’s super strange. and then I kind of started just adding a little bit more of my own personality into the show, my opinion a little bit. And, you know, that was six years ago. So now, like, I do entire solo episodes of my current podcast, which is very different from from the early stages. But, you know, I think overall, not only as a podcaster but as a person, you know, through that, I was able to just kind of have more confidence in, in myself and what I talk about, in my opinion. And I learned that, like, you know, even if you are interviewing other people, even if you’re the host, people still want to know about you, they still want they’re still coming to the show for you. So that was a really cool lesson that I learned early on. Joe Sanok 00:06:34 Yeah. And I think it’s interesting to think about how if you interviewed someone or if I interviewed the exact same person, even on the same topic, just the questions I would come up with versus the questions you would come up with would be completely different. Joe Sanok 00:06:46 And so allowing your own past to inform your shows your own point of view. the things that you’re struggling with and, you know, some people, you know, they’ll read every guest’s entire book. Whereas I’m like, I kind of want to go in with fresh eyes and, like, not have a whole lot of influence. Now, I miss some things in doing that, but I’m also a single dad. I’m not going to, like, spend all my time outside of work reading books for my podcast. So yeah. So if you were to kind of frame out the phases of your own podcast journey, take us through maybe the 3 to 5 phases you know, you’ve gone through in your own journey. Kevin Chemidlin 00:07:21 Yeah. Great question. I’ve never heard it. I’ve never heard it, phrase that way. So phase one was, it was new. I, I left my, the corporate job way too early. So, you know, I published the episodes. It got a little bit of buzz in, like, my social circle, and I just, like, pulled the trigger way too early on leaving the job. Kevin Chemidlin 00:07:40 So I gave notice at work because I was like, this is what I want to do full time. so phase one was I was living off of savings, spending all of my time interviewing really cool, successful Philadelphians traveling all around town it was super, super fun and naive. I think phase two would be when reality set in and, you know, my savings was going down faster than I thought it would. And I was like, oh, I don’t know how I’m going to monetize this thing. And also it’s not growing that much. So I thought that you just, you know, record podcast episodes and put them on the internet, and if they’re good, it’ll grow. so phase two was me learning the hard way that that is not true at all, and that you have to learn the skill of marketing the show and the skill of monetizing. and phase two came to a head with me almost giving up. I had to put the show on hold and took a break because now I was out of cash, and I kind of had this moment where I had to decide whether to go back to the corporate job or see if I can, you know, just power through and figure this out. Kevin Chemidlin 00:08:41 Thankfully, I powered through and then phase three and like I took six weeks, studied every single podcast on the top 100 charts. Like, what do they sound like? How are they monetized? Like, how are they growing What are their social media handles look like? All that stuff. Took a bunch of courses. Like I just went into this intense period of study, which I came out of that and went into phase three, which was, growth, right where Philly who I was like, oh, okay. Marketing a podcast is a skill. Monetizing as a podcast is a skill. I can do it too. And that’s where phase three was 2019, where I, you know, was able to generate six figures from the show. And I just kind of worked on the show part time, and it was my full time income, which was awesome. And then phase four was after Covid hit, I, you know, as we all experienced a moment of quarantine, we were all kind of sitting at home with not much to do unless you had kids. Kevin Chemidlin 00:09:32 I didn’t have kids, so I didn’t have much to do. and, I just I kept getting messages and calls from other podcasters who were like, hey, how did you do this with Philly? Who? So I was getting on a bunch of calls and like, oh, this is how you grow. This is how you monetize. And after like the 30th or 40th call, I was like, you know, I think there’s an opportunity to build something here that could help a lot of podcasters, because clearly I’ve managed to figure something out that a lot of other podcasters haven’t. so phase four was my beginnings as a, I don’t know, podcast pundit, if you will, a podcast growth guy. And, that phase wasn’t super fun, actually, because it was. I launched my coaching program, didn’t know the first thing about running a coaching program or consulting or anything like that. So that was another period of time of struggle because, you know, I, I was like, what the heck? Like, how do you sell? Like, how do I get in touch with podcasters who need help? And then the last, I guess, the last phase, which has been going on for like four years now, was once I launched the Grow the Show podcast, which I feel like I’ve said the word podcast billion times already in this interview, which is so funny, but, once I launched Grow the Show, share my knowledge with podcast growth. Kevin Chemidlin 00:10:38 That’s when the inflection point happened for my coaching business. Because. Because before that I was trying to sell people on coaching and they didn’t know who I was, and they didn’t listen to Philly, who because they weren’t from Philadelphia. So they had no reason to believe that I knew what I was talking about. Once I started putting out podcast episodes that shared what I knew and and the experiences that I’ve had and the challenges that I’ve solved, that’s when people started being interested in coaching. And then since then, it’s been a four year whirlwind where the the business and grow. The show has grown beyond what I ever imagined it could. Joe Sanok 00:11:09 Yeah. Now, phase two, when you’re struggling, almost threw in the towel into phase three when you’re growing and monetizing. Like, what did what did you shift? You said you listened to a bunch of podcasts or a bunch of courses. Like, what were some practical things you implemented to grow the show and to monetize it? Kevin Chemidlin 00:11:25 Yeah. So I’ll first talk growth and I’ll talk monetization. Kevin Chemidlin 00:11:28 So with growth, I came in with the belief that if you build it, they will come. And when you’re a first time podcaster you tend to have this belief. And you know, it’s because everybody what everybody tells you when you first launch a podcast is be consistent. Just be consistent and be consistent. Right. So every podcast are out there knows the consistency rule. Everyone is like oh, I’m being super consistent, right? Which is good. Like, you have to be you do have to be consistent. But consistency is table stakes. It is a baseline requirement. It alone will not grow your show. So the first insight that I got was, oh, in order to grow a podcast you have people have to discover that you exist somewhere else other than your podcast feed, because they’re not going to come across the feed and subscribe to it unless they are told to in some way, shape or form. and so I learned how to use social media to, get the word out about the show. Kevin Chemidlin 00:12:22 And the practical tip, there is a lot of people are trying to promote their podcasts by promoting on social media and being super like promo and like a new episode available now. Go listen to my podcast, which those posts didn’t work well in 2018 and they really don’t work well today. so the secret that I learned there was you. You spread the word about your podcast, not by promoting yourself on social media, but by participating on social media, by getting out there talking about the stuff that your podcast is about, on social media, whether that’s on your platform or in forums or whatever. So I started doing that regularly, and both my social profile and my show began to grow. And then the other thing that I learned was that the best way to spread the word about your podcast is to collaborate with other shows, collaborate with other podcasters. And if you think about it, it makes sense. Like if I wanted to go, what would be the most efficient way for me to get a message to podcast listeners? It’s probably by showing up on other podcasts, right? It’s probably 100% of the people that you reach with that strategy are podcast listeners. Kevin Chemidlin 00:13:24 So those are the two big growth insights. It was like, oh, you know, just publishing, publishing, publishing, publishing doesn’t do anything. I have to have marketing activities. And then as far as monetization, I came into it with the belief that you, quote unquote, monetize a podcast by getting sponsors. And, you know, when I speak with podcasters today who haven’t monetized yet, they’ll say, like, how do I monetize? How do I get sponsors? And they say that, like within the same breath. But what I’ve learned is that you actually want to decouple your understanding of podcast monetization from sponsorships. Sponsorship is a way to monetize a podcast. It is not the way to monetize a podcast. And the insight that I that I got was that really the like the only way, in my opinion, to monetize a podcast is by getting your listeners to buy something, whether that is something from your sponsors, because the sponsorship is just a company paying you in advance for your listeners to buy their stuff. Kevin Chemidlin 00:14:18 That’s all a podcast sponsorship is. Or if you don’t want to get another, you know, if you don’t want to have to find and convince another company to give you money in advance in the hopes that your listeners will buy their stuff, you can also sell stuff to your listeners yourself. So with Phile, who my show is monetized via several streams. I did have some sponsors, but I also threw live events and people bought tickets and I sold merch. And, you know, I did other stuff, like I sold some consulting for podcast production, like there was a bunch of different ways. but the key is that every single one of them translated to my listeners buying something. And that’s generally the advice that I give to any podcaster today is like, look, if you want to monetize you, the way to do that is by getting your listeners to buy something where you get a cut when they buy that thing again, whether it’s sponsorships or affiliates or in, you know, the case of probably most of our listeners, they actually buy your services, right, like you, and you get a cut of that, of course. Kevin Chemidlin 00:15:12 So those are the really, really big insights that propelled phase two into phase three. Joe Sanok 00:15:18 That’s really helpful. As a therapist, I can tell you from experience that having the right EHR is an absolute lifeline. I recommend using therapy notes. They make billing, scheduling, note taking, telehealth and e-prescribing is incredibly easy. And best of all, they offer live telephone support. It’s available seven days a week. You don’t have to take my word for it. Do your own research and see for yourself. 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So right now, 2024, I’m seeing three main ways that people are disproportionately growing their podcast audience. And when I say disproportionate, I mean their audience is growing compared to the amount of time that they’re putting into growing the show. Their audience is growing way faster than most podcasters, and those three strategies are number one, what I’ve already mentioned and what I’m doing right now, which is collaborating with other podcasters, that’s the first tried and true. I would find it hard to believe if that ever becomes not a good way to grow a podcast audience. So that’s it. But the difference is they they systemize it. Kevin Chemidlin 00:17:29 Meaning the podcasters that are growing today have a system for showing up on other shows. It’s not something that they just do every once in a while because they’re like, oh, I heard, you know, I heard that you should probably that I should probably do this. And then they get featured on two shows and nothing happens. And so they stop, and then maybe they try again in a year. No. Just like you have a system for consistently cranking out episodes, which you guys put out so many episodes consistently. I know you have systems built right to be able to crank out content as you do. Right? So you wouldn’t you wouldn’t be able to put out as many episodes as you do if you just kind of did it when you felt like it, or did it when you had time. Well, the same thing is true for being a guest on other shows. You want to systemize it. You want to have a system for identifying the right shows, to collaborate with a system, and a timing for when you reach out to those shows. Kevin Chemidlin 00:18:13 It’s again something that just you have a, an amount that amount of reach outs that you do on a monthly basis. And because of that, you get featured on podcasts regularly. It’s just something that’s always happening. That’s number one. Number two is social media. And so today in today’s social media landscape, the disproportionate growth I have seen has come again, not from promoting your podcasts on social, not from like publishing like oh, new episode available now and like putting just a headshot of who the guest was, but using the insights that were generated on your podcast to create native social media content, whether text or video. And what do I mean by that? Well, as an example, I just shared like 30s ago, an insight that in order to grow your podcast, you must systemize getting featured on other shows. So what you could do, Joe, is you could create a reel or like a TikTok or a short video that it doesn’t have to be repurposed. It doesn’t have to be me. Kevin Chemidlin 00:19:12 You know, a video of me saying it, you could just say, hey, I came across this amazing strategy to grow a podcast the other day, and you just list it out, and it’s just a very lo fi video. You’re talking to your camera and what I found, the folks that I work with, a lot of them get way more social media reach by doing something like that than by, you know, trying to repurpose, like just grab a clip or, you know, just, again, putting out a headshot and being super promotional about it. So, I mean, I’ve seen there was a client that I worked with last year, she launched a podcast. She started working with me to grow her podcast to support her coaching practice about being a, you know, she’s a perfectionist coach. But then once I sort of taught her the the fundamentals of of growth, she launched a second podcast with her sister about their favorite, like, fantasy book series, and they essentially started making TikTok videos based on the conversations that she and her sister were having on the podcast. Kevin Chemidlin 00:20:04 And within three months, they had gotten a million downloads of their show, and she shut down her coaching practice. She’s now, like, represented by Hugh Jackman’s talent agency. They’re on a huge podcast network, definitely a bit of an outlier experience, but the vast majority of their show growth came not from plastering clips and plastering images everywhere, but by literally just making videos that look like videos. They look like social media videos that somebody would make, based on what they’re talking about. And then the third thing is, is just YouTube. So I don’t talk about YouTube as much because we’re in a time period where there’s a lot of talk around, you know, whether or not podcasts should do video or, you know, is YouTube the future of podcasting? Whatever, whatever. and I don’t necessarily think that every podcaster needs to do video. We’re doing an audio interview, and that’s awesome. It’s kind of a relief. and you can totally have an incredible, thriving, growing podcast audio only. But it’s also true is that some of the biggest podcasts in the world right now, a lot of their their growth was driven by having really incredible video productions of their show and using, you know, getting to know the YouTube algorithm and learning how that works. Kevin Chemidlin 00:21:11 So that’s that’s the third big one. I tend to focus on the first two because, you know, those tend to be a little bit more accessible for the podcasters that I help. But in summary, those are the three really, really outlier strategies that I see working today in 2024 to grow shows. Joe Sanok 00:21:26 Yeah. And I think if you’re going to do video, I mean, you typically need to be in a larger market, like, you know, where you are. You know, I’m in Northern Michigan. to do in-person interviews. because I think that just films so much better. People, I think, are pretty sick of just the zoom. Like, let’s just, you know, steal Zoom or Riverside or any of the like online. Looks like it just doesn’t have the same appeal as, like, people sitting in a room and doing an Oprah type interview. so yeah, if you live in LA, if you live in New York, if you live somewhere on the coast where there’s larger cities where you want to interview a lot of local people, I think the video side is really great. Joe Sanok 00:22:03 And, you know, you see how much on TikTok or Instagram are those kind of things, but it’s just so hard to do if you don’t live in a big market where you can interview all of your guests in person 100%. Yeah. Now, when you think about next level growth, so when you have a successful podcast like yours or mine and you know, I think every podcast goes through its growth period and its plateau period and those plateau periods I think are very much needed because then you can kind of relook at your operations. That’s been about two years that we’ve said we’re intentionally not going to push into marketing and growing specifically because we want to make sure that we don’t have cracks, that if we double in size, are going to just become nightmares. So, you know, we’ve done a lot of cleanup because the things that it takes to get to six figures or multi six figures or seven figures are different. you can bootstrap yourself so far, but then you create these systems that you’re just like, you know what, if we double in the next year, there’s no way this system that we created or even these people, you may have hired people that worked great at a certain size, but then if you were to double the stress and capacity, they just don’t have the same skill set. Joe Sanok 00:23:07 So we’ve been looking at a lot of that for yourself. You know, when there’s times of growth or times of plateau. What does the infrastructure building look like? What does the like revisioning as you’re successful? Because it sounds like you’re a lot like me, where you’re just kind of shocked that you did it. Like, holy crap, this work. Like, I can’t believe. I can’t believe I get paid to talk to people. This is amazing. and then, you know, as you grow, you’re like, oh my gosh. Like, now I have all these people that are reliant on me for their jobs and, you know, for all these other things. What does growth look for you after you’ve kind of hit some of these success measures? Kevin Chemidlin 00:23:40 Yeah. So is it is it more like, how do I retool or how do I achieve the next level of growth? Joe Sanok 00:23:47 However you think through that whichever direction you want to take the question. Kevin Chemidlin 00:23:51 Yeah. So you know, what’s funny about it is like you’re probably talking about a downloads plateau, which I hear from all the time. Kevin Chemidlin 00:24:00 And a lot of people don’t believe this on the surface. But like, what I tell folks is that downloads are actually not as important as you think. Like, I don’t like I almost never look at my downloads because what’s important to me are is how many sales am I making and is my overall audience size growing. So the my first response is, you know, I don’t like if that if one of those two things plateau. I definitely go through, okay, where is the bottleneck here? You know what is currently holding things back? and so I, I’ve done that more on a business level than the show itself. but what I can say about the show itself is that there’s two things that come to mind. Number one is just, usually with a show, you might have already overcome this multiple times. Usually what I found is when a show plateaus, they. The best thing for them to do is to publish more. you know, whether it’s a lot of shows will be at once a week and they’ve hit a certain threshold and I’m like, hey, if you can like come up with a maybe a different format, that’s that’s less that’s, a little bit more efficient or just like less overhead for you to create and do that and publish twice a week instead of, once a week. Kevin Chemidlin 00:25:07 A lot of times, not only do your downloads double, but you just get more momentum. Like the feedback loop is quicker. There’s more stuff for people to talk about. So that’s the kind of the first thing is I’m like, okay, can we publish more? But then the other side of that is if we to your point, if we were to publish more, what about this would break. And usually that’s it’s I mean you nailed it. It’s something along the lines of there’s something that I’m doing that I really should have outsourced by now. like, for example, I, I encompassed this when I was still writing a lot of my intro scripts myself. Like, I would take an hour and a half and write like a really, really robust intro intro script to each podcast episode. And I was doing that because that was just kind of a relic of my old Philly days. That show was very, very NPR. Like, like I’m honored a lot after how I built this. So there was a lot of like, heavy voiceovers and stuff like that. Kevin Chemidlin 00:25:58 So there was a point, I think I want to say like 2021, maybe 2022 where I was holding the show back because every single episode I wanted to take an hour and a half and like, write this magnum opus like perfect intro. And and what I found is that usually the, the growth thresholds have something to do with me. It’s either I, it’s usually I’m holding on to something that I really don’t need to be holding on to anymore. So in that case, it was I hired a copywriter who suddenly was able to crank out intros that were better than mine, in a fraction of the time. And then that person was also able to help with a bunch of other things as well. So, you know, that’s kind of the way. The way I think about it is just, okay, could I publish more number one? And then number two, where am I the bottleneck? And I don’t so far those have one of those two questions has always solved the growth threshold that I’ve hit. Joe Sanok 00:26:52 How do you think through your personal time outside of work. Because I think as an entrepreneur we often there’s always something to do. I mean I’m always interested in how people set boundaries around how much they’re going to work and how much they’re not going to work. What’s that look like for you? Kevin Chemidlin 00:27:07 I’m not good at it at all. So it’s not good. because I just, I love doing it. And so if anything, like, I try, like, I’m in a point now where I’m trying to not work weekends, and it’s not because there’s just so much work to be done that I have to work weekends. It’s just if there’s a weekend that I don’t have, like my girlfriend and I go to tons of music festivals and we like to travel. So if there’s a weekend that I’m home and there isn’t something going on, I’ll usually just work the whole weekend But what I found is that if I do that by Monday, I am just completely gassed and I’m like, oh my God, I have to work another week right now. Kevin Chemidlin 00:27:41 And so it’s like I didn’t sleep. It’s like I pulled an all nighter. So I think I’m definitely in a place where I’m now that I’m now needing to come up with better systems for that. because I have a hard time not working if I don’t have some other, like, external commitment. But the thing that’s worked really well for me lately is I. I actually relocated to Miami a couple of years ago. I do love Philadelphia. I’m super passionate about Philadelphia, but, I just one of the things that I learned when interviewing a bunch of Philadelphians, I think I did 80 interviews and all of them either were from Philly and then moved elsewhere and gained a lot of perspective living somewhere else, and then came back to impact the city. Or they were from somewhere else to begin with. And I just remember, like noticing that and being like, wow, I’d never even considered living anywhere else. I think I want to try that. So Emily and I, my girlfriend Emily and I, we’re calling it we’re in our like, kind of grad school grad school phase right now where we’re living in Miami. Kevin Chemidlin 00:28:36 It’s so different. I’ve learned so much. So I bring that up to say, like my go to trump card if I’m like, not if I’m struggling to not work, which, you know, first world problems is to go to the beach. And just because I can’t work there, the the service isn’t good. the internet’s not good. And that’s one of the places where I can really. I just don’t have a hard time not working. So that’s been my my go to. But there will be a day when we live back in Pennsylvania, and I probably won’t be. I won’t live 15 minutes from the beach, so I’ll solve that when it comes. But that’s my go to for today. Joe Sanok 00:29:08 That’s good. Well, speaking of music festivals and knowing that you’re down in Florida, New Orleans Jazz Fest is incredible. It’s every year, the last weekend of April and first weekend of May. it’s so amazing we’re going this year. At the time of this recording. It’s before that. but yeah, like the Rolling Stones are headlining it this year and. Joe Sanok 00:29:26 Yeah. yeah, it’s it’s just an incredible festival. And the evenings end by like 6 p.m., so you can, like, go out and not just be like, so tired for the next day. Or you can go out to Bourbon Street or something else if you want to do so. Well, the last question, I. Kevin Chemidlin 00:29:39 Just go home. Yeah, seriously. Joe Sanok 00:29:41 I saw a thing recently online that said anyone you see over the age of 40 that’s out after 9:00, guaranteed, took a nap earlier in the day. Kevin Chemidlin 00:29:50 Yeah. Yeah, totally. Joe Sanok 00:29:52 Well, Kevin, the last question I always ask is if every private practitioner in the world were listening right now, what would you want them to know? Kevin Chemidlin 00:29:59 I would just if they don’t already have a show. I know I’m biased because I’m the podcast guy, but what I work with a lot of clients who have service based businesses and practices and stuff, and I have found that they are consistently surprised with the amount of folks, with the amount of other people that they can impact with a podcast, or even just with online content that is, you know, that are people who would never come into a brick and mortar because they don’t live in the same city or something like that. Kevin Chemidlin 00:30:24 Right? So the number one thing I would I would ask them to consider is, you know, if you’re not already putting content out there, you know, sharing your expertise, your unique stories, meaning like that, your client stories that you, that you are able to share or just like examples of breakthroughs that you’ve helped other people reach, whatever it might be. It’s just consider sharing with the world the work that you’re doing, because you will be surprised at the amount of additional impact that you can have, and potentially also the additional income too. So I think that would be my thing. Joe Sanok 00:30:56 so awesome. Well, people want to connect with you if they want to hear more. Where should we send them? Kevin Chemidlin 00:31:01 Yeah. So you can just go to grow the show comm. Pretty simple. the other thing is like, if you want to kind of get my crash course on how to grow and monetize and by the way, make a great podcast. I’ve got this email course. It’s called the 12 Days of Podcast Growth. Kevin Chemidlin 00:31:16 And so if you just go to 12 days of podcast growth.com, 1 or 2 days of podcast growth.com, it’s totally free. And within 12 days you’ll, you’ll have the gist of how to grow monetize. Joe Sanok 00:31:27 So awesome. Kevin. Well, thank you so much for being on the show. Kevin Chemidlin 00:31:31 Thank you Joe. This is a. Joe Sanok 00:31:32 Blast. I love seeing people that support therapists to dream bigger, whether it’s through podcasting or Ted talks or public speaking or membership communities, you know? I thought so many of my skills were only for the counseling office, and that is amazing work. It’s needed work. It’s good work. and there’s a lot of people out there that don’t live in your state. You’re not licensed in their state, but you have things that you can teach them that are so important. one podcast we’re working on right now is the Teaspoon podcast. And so our friend Doctor Kate, she’s launching that and she’s a therapist in New York that focuses on chronic illness. she is charging a ton of money per hour. Joe Sanok 00:32:26 She’s completely full. She’s building a group practice and as she’s done consulting with me, she realized that really, a podcast is the next step that, you know, to to talk about chronic illness. Her own story, interview people that helping her community in a different way. and so if you’re looking for help, reach out to people like Kevin, reach out to people like me, ask the questions, interview people, see who the best fit is, and take a step somewhere. Because if I hadn’t taken some of those steps back in 2012 when I took Pat Flynn’s podcasting course, it was a free option. That just gave me some very basics, like get a microphone, things like that. I wouldn’t have started in January 2013. I wouldn’t be where I’m at. I’d be years behind because I didn’t take imperfect action. So go take some imperfect action, go have some creative meanderings and start somewhere. test things out outside of your practice to see if they stick for you emotionally, if they build happiness, if it resonates with your audience, to just be able to start somewhere. Joe Sanok 00:33:28 And we couldn’t do the show without our amazing sponsors. Therapy notes is the best electronic health records out there. They will help you transition from whatever EHR you’re on that you are not satisfied with. They have real people that you can talk to that will help you with that transition. They also have HIPAA compliant video embedded within there, and they have the billing all automated to make it super easy for you or for your Billers. Check out Therapy notes.com. Use promo code Joe at checkout to get a couple months for free. Again, that’s therapy. notes.com. Use promo code Joe at checkout. Thank you so much for letting me enter your ears and into your brain. Have a great day. I’ll talk to you soon. Special thanks to the band silence sexy for that intro music. And this podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter cover. It is given with the understanding that neither the host, the producers, the publishers or guests are rendering legal, accounting, clinical or other professional information. Joe Sanok 00:34:23 If you want a professional, you should find one.