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Does future change make you uncomfortable? How can futures planning offer you more agency? Is there a way to get your team on board with your plans?
In this podcast episode, Joe Sanok interviews Charlotte Kemp about the advantages of futures planning.
Podcast Sponsor: Heard
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Regardless of whether you’re a seasoned clinician or are in the first year of your practice, Heard will identify areas for growth and streamline best financial practices for your business.
When you sign up with Heard, you’ll connect your bank accounts so your transactions will be automatically pulled in and categorized. My favorite thing about Heard is their “allocation guide,” which helps you decide how much to pay yourself each month and how much to set aside for taxes.
You’ll also receive financial insights, such as profit and loss statements and personalized monthly reports.
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Meet Charlotte Kemp
Charlotte Kemp is the Futures Alchemist, a futurist keynote speaker. She is the Immediate Past President of the Professional Speakers Association of Southern Africa (PSASA), and the Vice President of the Global Speakers Federation. She is also the author of a number of books, including ‘Futures Alchemist’.
For research and insight, Charlotte hosts a podcast series called ‘Futures Facets’ and interviews people around the world to gain an understanding of how we see the future from our different points of view.
Visit Charlotte Kemp’s Website, The Future’s Alchemist, and connect on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn.
FREEBIE: Read Charlotte’s e-book, Futures Literacy, the Professional Development Skill We Are Missing
In This Podcast
- What is Futures Planning?
- The Four-Step Futures Plan
- How to Notice and Respond to Trends
- Helping Your Team Manage Change
- Charlotte Kemp’s advice to private practitioners
What is Futures Planning?
It’s about creating the mindset that prepares us to anticipate the different ways we can go.
A futurist looks at models to anticipate the future. It’s important to realize that multiple futures are possible, depending on how you prepare for the future.
Futures planning is about developing the skillset which allows you to plan and anticipate the future based on your current business model.
The Four-Step Futures Plan
- Gather Intelligence: What are the trends in your particular sector? What is happening in the lives of your clients?
- Manage Change: Change is a constant – the trick is learning how to manage it. Lean into change to find the best approach to managing it.
Whether it is driven from within us out so that we are causing the change or whether we feel that change is being imposed on us – that kind of attitude towards change is really vital.”
- Describe the future: This is where you look at possible scenarios and envision what might happen.
- Test Your Strategy: This is where you assess whether the systems or plan you’ve put in place is achieving the goals you’ve set out.
How to Notice and Respond to Trends
Start online, and research the particular trends within your industry or the part of the world that you are in.
It’s important to remember that just because everyone says something is a new trend, it does not mean that you have to follow it. Sometimes breaking from a trend can create its own opportunity.
When we look at trends we want to see if everybody is doing this… does it work for us or doesn’t it? A lot of practices might be going online or doing virtual work… and maybe that doesn’t work for you?
You can always establish a counter-trend and be individualistic in your work. However, you can only really do this once you know what is happening in your industry.
Helping Your Team Manage Change
- Have a clear and inclusive future plan. The more structured your plan, the more accessible it will be to others.
Many people are explorers. They’re willing to be led into the future if there is a brave sole to guide them.
- Don’t impose change on others because we don’t like change being imposed on us. Instead, invite people to co-create change with you.
- Accept change. Oftentimes our future goal is exciting, but the hard work required to get there is so daunting that we abandon our goal. The first step to achieving your goal is reaching a place of acceptance about what needs to be done.
Charlotte Kemp’s advice to private practitioners
The more you talk about and own your future, the more agency you will have, and the better future you will create.
Books mentioned in this episode:
BOOK | Charlotte Kemp – Futures Alchemist
Useful Links mentioned in this episode:
Check out these additional resources:
Meet Joe Sanok
Joe Sanok helps counselors to create thriving practices that are the envy of other counselors. He has helped counselors to grow their businesses by 50-500% and is proud of all the private practice owners that are growing their income, influence, and impact on the world. Click here to explore consulting with Joe.
Thanks For Listening!
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This is the Practice of the Practice Podcast with Joe Sanok, session number 802.
I’m Joe Sanok, your host, and welcome to the Practice of the Practice Podcast, where we cover everything around starting, growing, scaling, and sometimes even exiting your private practice. Hope your day is going awesome for you. When I think about my business, and even when I had my practice before I sold it in 2019 thinking about where it was headed, thinking about the future, thinking about what’s going to happen was a big part of trying to guess, trying to decide on what my next steps were. Because when we’re thinking about the future, when we’re thinking about where we’re headed, oftentimes it’s our best guess. We’re not doing it with data, we’re not doing it with much more than our hunch.
It doesn’t have to be that way, which is why I’m so excited today to have Charlotte Kemp with us. Charlotte is The Futures Alchemist, a futurist keynote speaker who works with organizations to co-create preferred futures. Charlotte’s the immediate past president of the Professional Speakers Association of South Africa, vice President of the Global Speakers Federation, and is a professional member of the Association of Professional Futurists. Charlotte’s also the author of a number of books, including Futures Alchemist, which presents a narrative of how to use her map, compass and guide model to navigate unknown futures. Charlotte, welcome to the Practice of the Practice Podcast.
Joe, thank you very much for the invitation.
I got to say, when I hear Futures Alchemist, my initial thought was like, oh, I don’t know about this. Is this a psychic or something like that. But then as we talked and to hear how you think about futures and your Four-Step Futures Plan and all that, it’s, I love actually the branding of it where it adds some intrigue where it’s like, oh, what is this person really talking about? So those of you that may have tuned out for a second, just stick around because I think Charlotte’s going to drop some values on us that are going to really help us understand some things. Charlotte tell us a little bit about how you got into futures planning, and I want to, after that, just talk about your Four-Step Futures Plan to start us off in the episode.
Fantastic, thank you, Joe. I came to futures meandering through a couple of other topics and work that I did over the years, but when I discovered this whole area and discovered that it was actually a real thing that you could study at university, you can get degrees and doctorates in it, I felt like I’d come home. All of the science fiction and fantasy that I’d read over the years now suddenly made sense. But again, for those in the audience who are not interested in that thing, this is not a fantasy. This is not nothing esoteric at all. It’s very, very practical, and there are some amazing, robust academic and business models that can help anyone in terms of preparing for the future. That is probably what makes me most excited, is that in the world, when we really hear about the good futures plans that are out there, they seem to be reserved for multinationals and for governments, and they’re not accessible to the everyday person. So there are a couple of us in the future’s world who are really trying to make this tangible to people so we can actually use these models even for a one person practice for a solo entrepreneur. The models are so good that they can be scaled up and down and very, very useful.
Now just so that we have some similar definitions, what is futures? What does that mean?
All right, so a futurist is looking at models to anticipate the future, we’re not predicting, there is no fortune telling here, but there are ways to anticipate different ways of looking at the future. As futures, we often refer to it futures with a plural because we do want to maintain that awareness that there are multiple ways that the future can unfold. So you and I could be sharing this moment in time, but we’re experiencing this moment in time very differently, which means obviously that our anticipation of the future is vastly different. Depending on what we’re anticipating, depending on how we prepare for the future, we could be going in different directions. So it still is a very much an open field and the skillset is to help us to start to think in a future’s mindset. That anticipation of the future then actually rolls out some ready, practical plans that we can respond to.
Now I know in episode 120, I interviewed my friend Noel Goodman, who is a super forecaster, does that forecasting with data. Is this in a similar type of vein, or would you say it’s different than that forecasting?
I think it’s quite different. I have lots of admiration for people who can handle data like that, but most people can’t. There’s so many things that we’re working on in our own businesses that we don’t have time to process vast amounts of data. So rather than trying to do that forecasting it’s about creating the mindset that prepares us to anticipate different ways we could go. That’s why, and we can mention later the scenario planning is so powerful because it gives us the opportunity to start to look for the signs of things happening that could be a good sign that we want to lean into, or signs that things are happening that we don’t like and we want to start avoiding. So it’s a much more practical way for everyday people to use futures rather than the people that even the futurists admire who are the really good forecasters.
All right, cool. That helps me conceptualize it. So for the everyday practice owner, you have this Four-Step Futures Plan. Why don’t you walk us through the four steps and then we can dig into some of them?
Sure. It’s one of those deceptively simple four step models that people say, well that’s far too easy. But the idea is to create the model and to be able to play around with it. Literally, anybody can use it. My daughter is studying in university, and she listened in on one of my sessions the other day, and she got so excited that she could apply that to thinking about her studies. So it really is that accessible. But within those four steps, or those four stages is encompassed all of the models, all of the programs that are out there. In fact, any futurist that you ever hear speaking about anything, whatever they’re talking about, will fall somewhere within these four steps. So very simply, the first one is to gather intelligence to gather the information we need. So our super forecasters will be gathering a great deal of data but we want to gather intelligence about what are the trends in our particular sector, what are the trends, what is happening in the life or the culture of the city that we’re based in, what is happening in the lives of our clients?
That’s just data and information we need to gather. Any business or practice would be looking at that anyway. But once you’ve got that in information, and once part of that gathering of intelligence is a little bit of the, what would I be doing next with this information in terms of futures thinking? Once you’ve got that, then you want to go into stage two, which is managing change and, we’re going to be changing anyway. Every day that we move into the future, there are going to be changes in our lives, our businesses, our practice the world around us. So change is happening, but how we approach change, how we manage change, whether it is driven from within us out so that we are causing the change, or whether we feel that change is being imposed on us, that attitude towards change is really vital in terms of getting the best value out of it.
So we want to lean into change, it’s going to happen anyway, so let’s find the best approach to it. That was stage two. Stage three is describing the future, and that’s the fun part for me. That’s where we are looking at scenarios and we are looking at visioning, and we’re looking at explaining to our clients in terms of whatever we are trying to teach them or coach them or work with them on that if they make these changes in their lives, this is the future that they can have for their own health or for their business. Alternatively, if they don’t, then there are the consequences. So that was stage three. That was, first step was gather intelligence, then manage change, then describe the future, and then any good business or any good model. Stage four is to test your strategy and see how are things working out? If I’m trying to do something to create this progress in my business, did it work? Did it not work? Then you go back around and you start looking at stage one again, very simple, but anything you learn about futures will be somewhere in those four stages.
Let’s walk through a typical private practice and how we would implement these four stages within that. So gathering intelligence and trends, what would a therapist, whether they’re a solo or a group practice owner, what data intelligence trends should they be looking at?
When you go online and you look for trends, honestly, just go online and start searching for trends in your particular industry or your sector, the part of the world that you’re in and you’ll find a whole lot of trends that have been revealed for that space. People get really hung up on trends, thinking that this is the way it has to be, that the whole world is going in that direction, and that is simply not true. So when we look at trends, we want to see if everybody is doing this, or if media is saying, everyone is doing something, doesn’t work for us, or doesn’t it? So a lot of practices might be going online or going digital or doing virtual work or virtual consulting or therapy. Maybe that doesn’t work for you. Maybe what is really inside of you is something that you want to express by walking out of nature, taking things slower.
Once we’ve identified what, what the trends are, it is okay for us to say, I don’t like that, and I’m going to go in the opposite direction. So then we establish ourselves, our counter trend and we decide to put our practice in a different direction. But we can only do that once we’ve really thought it through and understood what is happening out there. There’s some big mega trains and there’s some big themes. The themes are that the world is accelerating, that the world is getting faster, that a lot of people, a lot of parts of the world are looking at mini, I always get that it’s a problem, minimalism, reducing waste, reducing time spent because things are getting faster. So you can look at those big themes, but then you can still find a way to define how you want to express the work that you’re doing with your clients.
I love that you use the word counter trend. I’ve talked about this frequently about how when I look at other consultants in the private practice space a lot of them are doing the more trendy TikTok dances or they’re pointing and then having five anxiety tips, whatever. They’re great. It really works for them. Like if they’re dancing or putting on a wig or whatever, that’s just not me. it’s not like, so I’ve actually gone the other direction where I’ll just if I pull up at the grocery store in my truck, I’ll just pull up my phone and take just a video of me in a V-neck t-shirt. I won’t be made up at all, and I’ll just talk about something I’m thinking about.
So it’s more intellectual reels on Instagram rather than maybe as like, funny or silly, or make people laugh. Of course, I want to entertain people, but I want to entertain them with the way I’m thinking more than just like I’m hilarious, which I am hilarious, but I mean, but it’s just like to have it really be a counter trend, to have it be like authentic to how I feel, I want to approach the social media world. So what would it look like in regards to managing change, so step two for a private practice, what’s that look like for our listeners?
All right. So managing change I think is probably really essential for any of us who are, who are trying to cause change in other people. Even the work that I’m doing, it’s either going to be an intellectual change or a change in our heart in terms of the approach that we want to do. Then you have to see that in action and I’m sure your listeners and your audience have a lot of their own experiences. I found a couple of things to be useful when I’m talking to people about change. The first one is, what I mentioned before is we don’t like change imposed on us. If somebody tells us we have to do something, we go to a doctor and they say, your blood pressure’s too high and your cholesterol’s too high, and you must stop exercising, we don’t like that.
If you make the mistake of coming home and telling your spouse then the next morning they’re saying you have to get out of bed and you have to exercise and you can’t eat the bacon sandwich. We don’t want that change imposed on us. So if we recognize that, then we don’t want to do that to other people. We don’t want to tell our clients that they must change. We want to invite them into a conversation to co-create a change that will be beneficial for the future for everyone involved. When we feel like the change has been initiated from within us, then it is so much easier to embrace. The other part of changes that we like the, well, we are in a particular place and we see that there’s another place that we want to be in, and we might want to really want to be in that other place, but it is that messy transition between the two that is so difficult.
Even when I’m talking to people about futures thinking they might see the value of doing that work, but the effort of learning a new language about how to talk about the future, the effort of learning new models and seeing how it works and getting the data and the information together, that seems a little overwhelming because it’s messy. That transition period is what we are trying to avoid. So if we can find a way to bridge that, or to help people to move through that, or to really embrace the potential future that they could have so much that they’re willing to get through it, is going to make the whole process so much easier.
It’s never too early to start thinking about tax season. Heard is the financial back office built specifically for therapists in private practice. They combine smart software with real humans to help you manage your bookkeeping, taxes and payroll. Regardless of whether you’re a seasoned clinician or are in the first year of private practice, Heard will identify areas of growth and streamline best financial practices for your business. When you sign up with Heard, you’ll connect your bank accounts so your transactions will automatically be pulled in and categorized.
My favorite thing about Heard is their allocation guide, what helps you decide how much to pay yourself each month and how much to set aside for taxes. You’ll also receive financial insights such as profit and loss statements and personalized monthly reports. You can say goodbye to pouring over spreadsheets and guessing your tax deductions or quarterly payments. Focus on your clients and Heard will take care of the rest. Heard always has transparent pricing with no hidden fees. Sign up for a free 15-minute consult call today at joinheard.com/partners/joe. Again, that’s joinheard, like I heard it, not like a herd of cattle, joinheard.com/partners/joe.
You used a term invite change, and a lot of folks listening are the business owners. So they often have less people outside of them saying, you need to change. As much as they may have a vision for something, how can they invite change in their own organizations? So it doesn’t feel like if they’re going to their assistant or other clinicians, that those people feel like they’re being pushed into change, but instead they’re inviting them into a different type of future that’s maybe better for the business or better for clients.
Yes. I’d love to have a better way to describe this because I don’t want it to sound manipulative, but the person with the vision to change is already creating the future. That person already has a picture of what they want the future to be, and we need more creators of the future. But not everyone is a creator. Many people are explorers. They’re willing to be led into the future if there is a brave soul to guide them in that direction. I think what needs to happen is that creator of change needs to have a really clear understanding and a definition of their values and their picture of the future and why that picture of the future is a good one, an inclusive future for everyone, and why it is worth taking that journey into the future.
Then they need to sit with the team and help them to paint that picture and get them to start contributing to how that journey would look, what they would do to get there. Rather than saying, okay, I’ve come up with a plan, these are the steps we’re going to take, and we will be like this in the future and from now on it’s going to be different and none of us responded well to that, even when our parents tried it when we were younger. So we need to have that conversation and allow the space for the team to be able to express some version of their future and incorporate that into the future plan. It really does need to be co-created futures that are imposed on people very seldom serve everyone in the team.
Now are there any other tips to help with that messy transition? You had said that gap is where it often gets messy. You just gave some great tips. Any other tips on just how leaders can enact that future while making it a little less messy for their team?
I think if we move on to the next part and we look at the describing the future, I think it actually does serve that. So describing the future would be describing what that good future would look like and the benefit it would have for people, and then describing equally the future that we want to avoid. So what very often happens now with businesses is they create a business plan. Our business plans, business advisors tell us we need it, the bank tells us we need it, and we create a business plan. Very often, once it’s done, we put it aside and then we just muddle along responding to everything else that is going on in the world. Now I’ve got bad news for you. Now we need to have three business plans because we need to have three scenarios.
The first scenario is this utopian one. It’s the best thing ever that could happen to your business is going to happen in the next couple of months. It is going to be awesome. You’re going to get the best clients, you’re going to have so many opportunities, and it’s really, really exciting. You need to create that scenario in your head. You need to imagine what it looks like, and you need to experience the emotions of it, because when we get excited, all the emotions start flooding into our bodies. Then we have, because of these emotions, we can’t make logical plans. We’re getting excited about how we’re going to spend the money and what we’re going to do and how impressed people will be. So we need to get over the emotion, and then we need to create some logical plans, including a business plan for the best year of your business life ever.
Then on the flip side, your dystopian version, the worst case scenario, literally. There you’re looking at things are going to get worse. If you thought Covid was bad and disruptive, that was nothing, and you want to create that negative plan. It really is negative thinking. It’s the opposite of positive thinking. I don’t say this flippantly, I say this pretty seriously. If you’re going to do that exercise, do it in a safe place and a safe time. Don’t do it on a Monday morning in the office with other people around you because if it triggers anything in yourself, you’re going to have a really tough time recovering. So in a safe place, safe time. Imagine that worst-case scenario, let your body and your brain feel those emotions and then get past the emotions, and then sit down and logically work out the business plan.
Will you need to lay off stuff? Will you need to take a loan? Or how would you pay back a loan that you already have? What’s going to happen to your clients? You want to work out all those practical steps. Then the third scenario is our everyday, middle of the road, next year is going to be 10% better than last year plan. Once you have those three, it’s so much easier to talk to the team, to be able to explain to the team, this is what we’re looking at, this is where we want to go, and maybe we never get that absolutely wonderful, awesome version of the future but we can get pretty close there because now you’ve got a business plan for it. Now you can anticipate some things. Now when you see an opportunity, you can jump on it because you’ve trained your brain to think of it. On the flip side, if something is going wrong and something happens, there’s a little red flag that pops up and says, remember your worst-case scenario? This is what it could look like. You want to address that really quickly, and you can, because you’ve thought of it, and now you’ve given that language to your team, and they’re able to come back to you and share their concerns or their plans, or they can alert you to things that they’re seeing either the good opportunities or the warning signs.
So utopian, dystopian, middle of the road, three different, any essential things in those plans, how deep do you go into each of those plans?
I think as a first run when people are first learning futures thinking to just, to do it lightly, just have a, spend an hour or two just sketching them out, so not in too much detail. Once you’ve got that first experience, you can start to work deeper. In big companies and corporates when they do a scenario planning exercise, it can run to nine to 18 months because they go deep into creating immersive futures to experiment with things and see what products they’re going to come up with and test out emotional responses. But for a practice, I think just having that exercise the first time, go through it in an hour or two, see what it feels like, and then maybe if you have the capacity, maybe take the team away for a few days and see can you spend some time really exploring this?
Because you’ll find new skills and find things coming out of your team that you didn’t know were there because they’re responding to different issues. There may be some emotional things that people need to deal with, and once they’ve dealt with it, they will be so much more robust and capable of dealing with any of those challenges because both the good and the bad scenarios can actually trigger in us our anxieties about what we’ve experienced in the past or what we could be experiencing in the future. But the more we talk about it, the more we have a language for it, and the more we make it normal to be able to have this conversation then the easier it is for people to actually anticipate. All that anxiety about the future is removed. Even when things are potentially very good, it is the unknown of what is happening of what is coming. It’s the huge amount of variables and uncertainty that causes our anxiety. If we’ve got all these plans and we’ve had the conversations, then the anxiety is immediately reduced, and then it’s so much easier to deal with the day-to-day challenges.
So what about step four, test the strategy? What’s that look like?
Test the strategy? Well, that would be any, of business plans or any other statistics that you’re keeping or the numbers at any good practice should be keeping, and you want to go back to that every now and then and say if you’re aiming towards, once you’ve done the scenarios, if you really want your practice to grow, if you want to scale it, what would those numbers look like? Then you want to work backwards and how are you going to find new clients? How are you going to be able to scale? Or what products are you going to introduce into your business or what services? Then you’re just going to keep track of those. There are some really interesting models. One is called wind tunneling, so when they build an airplane or a car and they’re put into a wind tunnel, they see if it works.
If you’ve got a business plan and you’ve worked it out and you think this is going to help us to scale. Then spend some time imagining that it is eight months later. So it’s eight months in the future, and you’re sitting down now celebrating and you’re saying, how did we do this? Now you’re looking backwards and say what were the steps that we took to get to this date where we’re celebrating this great success and what parts of our plan that we thought about would be working or which parts would not be working? Then you can actually get some good insight about how you could achieve those successes.
Wow. I have so many notes. Our show notes are going to be robust from this episode. So when you think about when practices go through these four steps, they create the three plans, what would they expect to see? I love how you say when people just know, okay, here’s the plan for a utopian, here’s the plan for a dystopian, just like that unknown is taken out. What do we see happen when businesses walk through this type of future planning?
I think one of the first things is that that reduction of that anxiety because now we know what we are dealing with, and even if we don’t know which one it is our brains have been given that capacity to think about it now. A lot of this is about giving the brain the space. Our brains are trying to protect us from the unknown, from potential danger. When we say, look these are some things that could happen, and yes, they might not be good, but they are not they’re not life-threatening necessarily. So stopping so anxious, let’s find some creative ways to respond. That allows the brain and allows the team to come up with some creative solutions. All of a sudden you’ll find people saying, oh, I’ve just seen this online and that could be applied in our practice or I’ve read an article where they’re doing something on the other side of the world, and why don’t we try that here? So there’s a lot more freedom to experiment, to be creative, to be innovative in how we’re doing things. Those innovations will lead us hopefully more towards the side where we have in those better futures, those better scenarios. The innovative thinking is, it’s not invention, it’s not brand new, it doesn’t have to be never, ever heard of before. We just need to prime our brains to look for those signs that if this has worked somewhere else, it might work here and we have the freedom to experiment with it.
So, awesome. The final question I always ask is, if every private practitioner in the world were listening right now, what would you want them to know?
Well, I discovered recently doing a futures exercise on myself that one of my highest values is agency. It’s something, it’s probably not a common value that people talk about often, but agency is that idea that we have agency over our futures that we can make choices ourselves. Now, of course, there are laws and rules and things that we do need to comply with but the more we talk about and own our futures, the more agency we have. If we can understand that if we can take responsibility for our futures, we stop feeling like victims. Even if we say, oh, I don’t feel like that there’s a part of us saying this is happening to me, this has been imposed on me, and we need to be able to get past that, and we need to be able to pass it on to other people as well. The more we take responsibility for the future, the more agency we have, the better futures we will create. My own personal perspective on this is that they should be inclusive futures. They should embrace other people and not just be created to serve me and my inner circle. They should be able to embrace other people as well.
So, amazing. If people want to connect with your work, Charlotte what’s the best place to send them and how can they get your book?
Good, thank you. I’m on LinkedIn, Charlotte Kemp on LinkedIn, and I have a website called futuresalchemist.com. If you go there, you can contact me and ask for the book, which is an Introduction to Futures Literacy. If you subscribe to the newsletter on Futures Alchemists, there’s a whole lot of really good content that I share about how we can unpack these different ideas, lots of models and downloads as well.
Oh, so wonderful. Thank you so much for being on the Practice of the Practice podcast.
Thank you, Joe.
Wow, so many awesome, just things to cover there, the four steps, the three plans, so many different things I’m going to take action on personally.
We couldn’t do this show without our sponsors, and Heard is our sponsor today. Heard helps you with all the tax stuff, all the bookkeeping stuff that is just a pain to keep track of. You’ll also get, you’ll also receive financial insights like your profit and loss statements, personalized monthly reports. I know I am really glad to not be pouring over spreadsheets and guessing tax deductions or quarterly payments. Instead, you can focus on your clients and Heard will take care of the rest. That is spelled like herd, like I’m listening, I heard you say that. Prices begin at $149 per month for solo practices and can easily be tailored to fit your business’ financial needs. You can sign up for a free 15-minute consult over at www.joinheard.com/partners/joe. That’s joinheard, like I heard it, joinheard.com/partners/joe.
Thank you so much for letting me into your ears and your brain. Have a great day. I’ll talk to you soon. Bye.
Special thanks to the band Silence is Sexy for your intro music.
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