Pop 236 | Brian Kang Has Some Questions

[0:00] Those are great and it is not just the opportunity cost of the time it is the mental energy like if you hate design,
and your therapists out there that wants to build your own website but it drains you and it’s not just the time that you a that we can do other things that’s also the mental energy it takes to think about it play.

[0:19] Music.

[0:44] You are in the right place if you are starting growing or stealing a private practice this is the practice of the practice podcast and i’m just like your post.
Welcome we’re all about teaching you the things that we didn’t learn in grad school and i’m so excited to be your guide in this process i interview different people.
And talk with topics every single week if your brand new here welcome i’m so glad you discovered us we have over two hundred episodes that woke you through everything that has to do with private practice and i’m just so glad that you’re here.
Today is a unique episode and it’s all about the reverse interview i was on brain kings podcast business of psychotherapy recently,
and loved this interview and he asked some questions and nobody’s ever asked.
And so want that for you on the first if you haven’t participated in our weapon our series on throughout the coming months i’m gonna be doing tons of weapon hours because i really enjoyed getting to know all of you doing question and answer,
and just building my own skill set regards to weapon ours headed over to practiceofthepractice.com/practiceessentials,
we’re covering governors all how to start a practice how to fill a practice how to add insurance if you wanna insurance to practice,
how to use the video marketing within your practice and also have a compliance and i’m not doing tons more in the coming months to make sure that you have signed up over at practiceofthepractice.com/practiceessentials me some of them and they be doing a lot more,
and also in september two thousand seventeen and doing another one of my challenges where did you write an e-book in a month and so.

[2:21] We’re gonna alright you books in a month and it’s gonna be awesome could set up for that over practiceofthepractice.com/challenge.
And we’re gonna be doing we have a peaceful community are honest poorly free would love to have you engage with us on that.
And now without any further ado Brian King interviewing me.

[2:40] Music.

[2:46] Today’s guest is joe sanok who is a speaker therapist business consultant and podcasters joe has the number one podcast for counselors the practice of the practice podcast.
What interviews with kaplan john lee dumas chris tucker rob bell legend oil mountain and was how’s joe is a rising star in the pod casting world.
Joe is also a writer for psych central he’s been featured on the huffington post reader’s digest bustling in yahoo news he is a keynote speaker author of five books and is also a top consultant a joe has gone aka brian’s awesome.

[3:20] Yeah i appreciate your time is going on how you on the show today i appreciate i’m really glad to be here.

[3:26] Off the lights is dive straight in this if you can share live with it and some yo what’s your story of how you became a therapist and maybe the beginning stages that the journey,
yeah the beginning stages goes back a while in second grade i wrote a paper about how you want to be a psychologist and whatever else might be a fire,
later after is the best players that i want to be a psychologist my dad was a school psychologist and so.
I want to see a lot of the freedom he had and that the human mind and,
one of my earliest memories is doing d also like intelligence testing were here id and tell testing me so i always found counseling and therapy really interesting.
Then in graduate school i really explored like what was it that i was interested in vs what i thought maybe my dad was interested in size less interested in the testing and the school side of it.
And really into the experiential approach to therapy side so every paper i wrote in grad school is about backpacking therapy and also to different things like that.

[4:23] And then my first job out of grad school i worked for a shelter for kids that had for one reason or another been removed from their home and get you a lot of experience approaches of their b team building activities and then.
Couple years later it was two thousand nine and lost the therapeutic sailing program where we took kids out sailing on this old cat.
Cold richard basically that there be on the sailboat.
And no is really it’s like it all came together all the interest on nature and outdoors and healthy living in teaching these kids how to make the on meals on this boat and.

[4:58] You know there’s something about turning the motor off when you’re on a sailboat and it’s just quiet and the kids.
Yeah they just injure couple days we had an eighty percent reduction in their psychological symptoms and both intensity and frequency.
I really just like that’s right follow counseling really came alive for me and we can talk more about my private practice,
why does my back story in regards to being able to just really can’t connect to the counseling field.
That’s amazing things for sure and yeah that is true right in those moments of me i can get the visual that went on a sailboat and you,
turn off the motor and it says be a very beautiful description of that experience i appreciate that and you know the kids like these kids were from foster care in the judicial system.
They’ve not had a lot of power in their lives lot of control and this boat was so big there’s no way you can sell yourself you can put up the sales,
you can even how i see it you wouldn’t be strong enough so they had to work together as for steam building cuz otherwise just gonna bobbing the water.
And yes i’m at the helm someone the sales you to pay attention to the wind direction.
And so for them to have this control of this boat that the only replica of which the kennedy family owned,
it was a really big honor for them and you saw them go from feeling like life happens to me and i have no power over that to,
well i really could have some power in my life because i just ran the sailboat for a whole week and by the and i don’t even the captain’s help.

[6:21] This is amazing it’s amazing so does two thousand nine around that time and when did you actually decide to go into private practice for yourself.
Yes i don’t private practice and group practice a couple of years before that were was just kind of a side gig while i worked a community mental health.
My wife and i moved back to traverse city in two thousand nine it’s our home town of this beautiful northern michigan town,
answer started program was working as a foster care supervisor at that time and lunch the private practice really is a side gig to finish paying off,
student loans will just go by ten thousand dollars left at that point to pay it off cuz we’ve been super aggressive and paying it down,
and all the insurance panels are full and i had this mindset of like i should get an insurance they are all full so.
I said you know what i’m gonna just launch a private practice anyway at put up a website a found a space that i could lease as a percentage of what i brought in rather than have to have a commitment every month.
Just open my doors and was like i’ll see what happens and i got my first client and then a second plane clients get,
coming and then finally the insurance panels opened up and i’m like i don’t really wanna be on your insurance panels that true that people refuse to be like,
of the whole time that i was working my full time job i got a job at the community college as a counselor was like that golden ticket where you get state pension benefits you get the great health insurance that was just like the ideal counseling job.
Play practice growing and in what is two thousand thirteen,
my income there matched at my private practice matched my income my forty hour a week job says we’re going to ten hours a week there and the point i had three clinicians working for me while i was working my full time job.

[8:01] Then the next year i made almost twice as much and so it became really clear that was time for me to really look and accept plan because,
like if i can make this much working ten to fifteen hours a week what would happen if i dedicated all of my life into this.

[8:14] Yes different schools about that to write some people say hey keep a full time job until you matches some people just wanna.
Go for right away and take that risk does not i don’t think there’s a right answer to that but,
for you it sounds like you got a point where matching full timing,
i’ve read this yeah it for me i’m really risk averse like i pay down student loan debt i don’t take my credit card.
So i can do this is my natural can inclination my wife would have believed that job a year earlier,
she’s a stay at home mom and i we have two kids so for me it was a really big deal the family of this and i’d really change my mindset.
My dad worked for the school system my mom was the school nurse both of my in-laws they work for the schools all the adults in my life,
where like get a job work for somebody else like retire with a good pension,
so i had no entrepreneurs so i really liked you they offered a lot of other good things but for me it was a huge jumping huge mindset shift and as well two thousand twelve was a really rough year for us.
That year my daughter ready for her first birthday shit open heart surgery.
And then probably two weeks after i got the all clear from that i was diagnosed with thyroid cancer and so i went through cancer treatment.
I saw how expensive that would have been if we didn’t have quality insurance my wife had a miss carriage my mom had a heart attack and so it’s like.

[9:37] We really can i have mostly rebuild from that you can see just being able to go to full time job and not have it all be on my shoulders at that point that i can i had to like bounce back emotionally from that to really feel like okay,
it’s healthy for me to leave this job and i wanna go and can launch my own thing.

[9:53] Yes for sure and appreciate you opening up about the personal things that happen back in back in two thousand twelve so that those experiences today the impact you in,
moving for in your business in your life and what impact they have on you yeah i think when i was in two thousand twelve when large practice of the pro,
yes and i lost it really early in two thousand twelve so i knew my daughter is can we had heart surgery without was nearly simple version of it but ended up being we more complex.
Is a lunches websites with the idea of iphone of building carrasquillo bill income this now just pissed me showing up to counseling getting a certain amount cuz with that model,
the only way to make more money is to see more people raise your rates and like i was interested that burned out so practice of the practice for me was a way to really level up and to,
improve my lifestyle improve my income and also my impact on the.
But i did ask myself in two thousand twelve why am i spending time on this website on this blog post or plane in this podcast when my daughter is about to have her surgery i’m gonna have cancer treatment all these other things,
so it started in me something that you know i’d never wish on somebody else but i really had to say what’s gonna move the needle forward it goes,
in an hour he or my daughter or power on this blog post know this blog post better help me out with my bottom line more than just,
play,
and so that mindset for me i think he’s really helped me where i am value of my time in a really brutal way where i say should i be doing this or can i outsource it so for example written for this podcast,
one of my sisters came and she just started taking over on picking up drinks for our lobby so we have.

[11:25] Starbucks lacroix coconut water for our clients are coming to our practice.
I don’t that for years where i went to sam’s club on all the stuff and finally i like changer here’s but i want you to do.
And it’s you’re renting about how house is like a really big job to move all these drinks up.
And i’m like why did i do that years ago i’m on a podcast with you which to me is gonna,
help my career to help your audience or it could’ve been moving drinks at the el of unit so brutally asking myself what is this gonna help my career.
Or am i getting the way of my own growth as great as this is not just the opportunity cost of the time it is the mental energy like if you hate design,
and your therapists out there that wants to build your own website but it drains you and it’s not just the time that you a so we can do other things that’s also,
the mental energy it takes to think about it planet and so i definitely can relate and is this a great tips for audience yeah cuz i mean there’s those,
things that you hate doing that it is it outside the heat is it really bad at it and everybody’s like that kinda stinks,
yeah he’s it outsource for me was hired as the things he really love doing and fill you up but you probably shouldn’t be doing so for me design are i’ve always loved like,
are in design and all of that for me to outsource all my podcast design and stuff is really hard for me because,
i had to give up three hours of my week which is great get this back but i got some for film on that.
In order for me to continue to make the most of the three days a week i work i have to be cutting back as much as i can.
Got it got it but we just back up a little bit and talk about when you first are you private practice your still study full time job.

[13:01] You’re going to practice you’re getting a few clients here and start to grow what did you do during that time to start getting a full practice and maybe your first you know five to twenty sessions per week,
yeah,
so i’m gonna tell you what i did and why it was terrible and where people can learn from me it’s up a whole bunch of things that,
reserve yes in the first thing is looking at your website and so i created a website using microsoft office live which looks terrible,
i didn’t know anything about st i didn’t learn about as ceo i took forever i bootstrapped everything which is good when you first start it keep your costs low,
but i could’ve had a much better looking website if i had hoped had somebody else help me out with it maybe it’s that they just helped a little better did some design update.
So right away i’d say.
If you’re not very good at website design is probably worth spending fifty nine bucks a month or a thousand dollars to pay someone to create a great looking web site for you and i said as one of few places that they put money in right away because.
If you’re not good at it it’s gonna really show and if you turn away a client because it looks bad.
Like you work a lot of money if they come to six sessions and you charge a hundred bucks a session the six hundred dollars you lose pe.
Claim it so i definitely didn’t myself for a long period of time and just got a couple of clients where’s those that can update the website really quickly they tend to grow faster.

[14:28] Sorry i didn’t start blogging on a regular basis um a website for about a year,
and as soon as i start doing some intentional as ceo blogging around keywords focusing i went from the bottom of page three when you search traverse city counseling to the top of page one with in six weeks,
and so really effective blogging making contact on the website that’s applicable to your ideal client to me is one of the first things that i wish i had done as well.
Now it’s in the last ship is really intentionally thinking about who you want to attract.
Need a lot of times people are worried about if i mix down or five specialty mini,
but the reality of it is like think about you and just like if you go to a restaurant for example.
If you go to burger king and you say you know i want some fine french food can you guys whip up some fine french food you’re gonna be like no right so but if you went to a really fine dining restaurant near father in law comes with your niece wants a burger.
They’re probably gonna be pretty good at making a burger even if it’s not on their menu because they’re trained and find french cooking.
So the seems to when you specialize people make that assumption of if you’re amazing at couples work are you specialize in helping angry teenagers or people that cut or whatever your specialty is,
people will assume that you’re awesome and a whole bunch of other areas so if you can handle couples that are really fighting all the time it’s procure helping people depression or anxiety or other things going on in their life,
so focus on who you want to attract and then thinking was connected to that person so.

[16:01] Is there a pastor is a yoga teacher is it professors teachers per principles who is it that when they have something going on some big pain in their life,
who is it that the vent to and when the event what are they saying that becomes your blog post that comes your marketing materials that becomes all the content to speak to that person’s pain,
and then show them the outcomes of therapy that can help them get out of that pain.

[16:23] Okay so it is recapture the first thing is website maybe outsource that have a nice looking website so that you can not track clients there that way.
Second one was.
Oh god any search engine optimization so when just talking as ceo that search engine optimization using the right key words so that,
your rank single so cool take seventy words and so the other for the fifth page,
just by doing couple different strategies you can get on the first page of certain keywords the keywords things like traverse city,
you know there is a counseling and lastly is find the right of the clients the fear there’s a lot people i know i don’t wanna be a,
you know what just focus on this type of client because if i do that,
if you do find the right specialty then you will attract other toxic tonight is gonna be pigeon hole one type image yeah absolutely great summary.
Thanks for coming from right what’s the silver lining out there that’s struggling with the business side you know they just stay here the business side of marketing those words and i just feel this i know this is like.
It just brings a lot of feelings like they don’t wanna be pushy the rv sales the wanna be self promotional but day the person i know they have a lot to offer,
like maybe what are some tips you would give that person started a therapist i want to shift into the business mindset how to do that in the in the way that feels right to that therapist,
yeah so i used to be that way totally like and i think it still creeps in sometimes i am i.

[17:56] Senior year high school going to college this summer before going to college all my friends were selling this new product that they’re making all this money with me all you gotta comes.
If i find sign up for it and find it’s kirby vacuum cleaners so sonny’s vacuum cleaners door-to-door well driving like.
Learn all the sales techniques i didn’t think it was worth two grand some people out there might think that it’s worth two grand but.
If not really slimed me three going door-to-door this vacuum cleaner be like let me just demonstrated i sell you this two thousand dollar vacuum that’s.
To me for my personality the bad side of sales was a product i didn’t believe and,
a method that i didn’t believe and an audience that didn’t have the money and i was going to low income housing showing people how they could make money by spending two grand on this vacuum cleaner cycle terrible about it.
Note to the other side.
When we look at counseling i whole heartedly believe in the counseling process i’ve experienced counseling that’s help me its help my marriage self-improvement something that highly value.
I’ve done a lot of additional training a going to gotten certification i just finished level one minute you level to,
so for me i have the expertise and am i looking my audience the people that need it because the people i’m a track,
into my website through referrals and people that genuinely have angry kids there frustrated parents in the distant couples and the people i can help.
So all of the three areas that me made it feel slimy when i was selling vacuum cleaners door to door.
And so when you believe and your coat product which really is you it’s you and your skills and your ability to build up their puke relationship.

[19:33] It becomes a lot easier for that sales to happen excuse me.

[19:38] And so really looking at a three areas and one of the first steps the counselors can do to address that mindset absolutely so it’s not necessary like.

[19:48] Pushing people do some do it is believing in you and you are your you are your product or your services you and so you believe in that.
Then you gonna have the inclination to be able to promote on the right way just because you believe in the switch in mindset you not try to convince people to do something they’re not,
they don’t wanna do without offering that value that you have yourself all the training you went through all the schooling all the extra certifications saw all those things to be able that is to say hey this is what i do not believe in a harley.

[20:17] Yeah and if you think about so recently i had a number of clients there’s this like william of clients were asking about,
doctors they didn’t just prescribe psychotropic medication they wanted alternatives to if they are interested in chinese medicine acupuncture all these different,
excuse me approaches to mental health that would be just counseling.
And the only natural product that i referred you i haven’t had kind of the correspondence that i preferred,
i didn’t feel good about referring to them so i don’t have anybody so then i go to this local conference and this lady dr abigail speaks from sleeping bear natural health.
He talks all science of researching that knows the chemistry and here’s what works and these herbs work with this and i’m like blown away and i’ve sent her.
Either nine clients and have personally seen her and also my wife has seen her,
so think about it so i wanted to have someone to refer to you and when i found out about her.
I was thrilled some more than happy to refer to her because she’s helping me look better as a clinician so the thing about all of your listeners,
like what is the people that would be thrilled if they knew about you so maybe you focus on teen girls that are cutting have eating issues on sure everything is in town doesn’t treat that population if they get that type of client,
they’re gonna be like should i gotta find some referred you not thrilled to refer to,
if you are out there marketing yourself release building those relationships talking with people making sure your website optimized for those terms you on local radio or however you get your name out there.

[21:51] You are helping those people and also does referral sources are don’t know where to send you i’m sorry which is google it,
sing knowing that marketing is just telling people about you do and usually it’s.
Helping them feel relief because they actually have something that can refer to around that specialty yeah absolutely people need you out there when you listen to need your services and.
That’s a great way for me and also appreciate that this was years little bit in and talk a little bit about your website practiceofthepractice.com.
Something that you do on your website i really admire in and like is that your income reports and how you actually posts your very visible about the income you make in your,
your consulting as well as are your therapy private practice so,
help us a little bit about how that came about and why do you actually publish those and make them available for anybody to look at.

[22:41] Yep so interesting my wife and i have talked many times at what point you stop posting the flag of can awkward locally and have people know exactly how much it up.

[22:50] To me it starts with.

[22:52] We don’t talk about me enough as counselors and often times as the big money shame like i should make money this you be like my ministry rather than like my actual age.
Or keep a,
but we don’t see the plumbers we don’t say that about people that fix our house is you would never expect someone to you know come in and fix our toilet for twenty bucks an hour and negotiate down from hundred bucks an hour but for some reason because,
we’re aligning emotional with people we feel oftentimes money mindset day is like well we should be charging as much as were charging for this so party,
also i was really inspired by pat flynn and his smart passive income podcast really early on that he was like the first podcast that i been ge listens to,
and he posted his monthly income every single month and for me that was really inspiring to see,
him living out exactly what he was talking about and so i generally just took that idea and applied it to practice the practice from the very first month i opened it said,
okay here’s how i made money this month and my first month is eleven hundred dollars i made that month.
And here’s what i did here’s how i view my client base here’s where the money’s coming in and then you can look how i think i’ve had enough of a thirty thousand dollar month and twenty nine thousand the highest i’ve had,
so since two thousand twelve you i’ve had routinely over twenty thousand dollar month most months of two thousand sixteen say that three hundred some thousand dollars,
and it really is if you look at it just small growth over time it’s not that i went from a thousand bucks a month to thirty grand a month over night if that you can really watch it grow so for me.

[24:26] People can hear me on his podcast and they just get into brian’s podcast my gosh joseph how you do that.
It didn’t happen overnight you know it’s been like incremental changes steps in front of myself for each time can of cycling through how do i set it even outsource goals just me over and over.
And into me my hope is that inspires fear of the sea that if you keep going at something you’re gonna continue to grow and the finances are going to follow.

[24:53] Yeah than joe publishes it from the few years ago she can actually see the growth you can see the way that where it was and then i think you finish up two thousand sixteen at like.
Three twenty three three hundred twenty three thousand for the year some around there at that sounds amazing yeah using this as well as my glowing like me and my old college job give me sixty grand a year and i was like this is the golden ticket,
okay but really it and i use it now seeing my consulting clients and it’s not over guarantee but,
most of them into the six months of consulting will a double or triple their digit so it having some kinda can tell the kind that we just closed out yesterday so six months of consulting,
his girl already started so he was grossing and hundred twenty grand when we started and his ghost hit two hundred this year and now he’s on track,
three hundred and so it’s just like these basic principles that when you really understand almost like the hacks images so much easier to grow quickly.

[25:46] Yeah yeah you’re actually right from a point you said earlier is that lot therapist like the mutually exclusive helping people that i shouldn’t be making money off of it so there’s this conflict at times but you’re saying that hates about.
It’s not just now it’s about it’s about doing both and they’re not mutually exclusive things the things that can happen together in your you’re living proof of that yeah i think about,
the average counselor for casket out with that looks like they’re usually overwhelmed maybe they worked a non profit,
it might be doing five or six sessions a week if they’re not at their private practice they really wanna grow and leave at nonprofit.
So what happens when you have healthy counselors that are working fifty or sixty hours a week.
They’re barely keeping up with their private practice the showing and do their sessions are there hustling and saturday mornings and not spinning time with their families all,
def not sustainable that’s me that’s a chapter in a book like this we gotta hustle you gotta sprint you gotta put in that time and that is needed,
it can be how you sustain and so asking yourself what’s my exit strategy here to you it really growing to something different.
And the bottom line is that helps your income it helps your influence and then it helps you impact on the world in the more that you can do that the more you’re gonna continue to level up.

[26:59] It’s a good segway into the things that you’re talking about pretty often we should about it before we recording but,
i hope kinds of slowing down because as entrepreneur’s were like always thinking about things were go always of yourself,
phones and is and we feel that when we’re in that space of go that’s actually gonna be more,
you are seeing a lot about slowing down so what is slowing down for you and how can that there is this thing out there start to slow down in order to have more creativity in their business and life.
Yeah thanks for asking that so when we look at the highest achievers in our societies so the richard branson the steve jobs winston churchill.
The the most innovative thinkers of the twentieth and twenty first century had have really clear slow down habits so sir richard branson he meditate and does yoga every single day it starts off as day putting is best into his body,
steve jobs’s some of his most important meetings he would be walking meetings and often they be barefoot on the grass,
a winston churchill every single day were taken out even during the war and so.

[28:06] When we see people that can do that much in regards to impact our world but still found time to slow down weekend of don’t have an excuse to not do that,
to think that we have to go to certain pace is unsustainable and a lot of ways so what i’ve done in my own life for probably three years on the weekend,
there’s a time that i can say i’m done with the work week and so it can a very some days it’s friday at noon and or checks in the mail sometimes the panties maybe a little bit later.
But i will intentionally saying my phone my family i am not going to check email i’m not going to check social media making a do business pod,
and they don’t come back to that business thinking until usually sunday afternoon.
And if something is that i’ve observed that i go through and i’ve noticed that most of my clients when i worked with consulting clients to slow down to,
where innovation go through the start by is a purging phase where you can i have this compulsion to pick up your phone you know it’s like,
my daughter was in the room and i should check facebook no set your phone down jolie this is not okay like you are not doing so,
it also gives going anxiety get things done for your business and you have to purge that out and then.
A cat moves and practices and so finding things that will intentionally distract me from business that will,
help me connect with my family my friends and so that could be having friends over for dinner and playing board games or,
going to the children’s museum or something that can set a clear boundary around that time and then it will naturally happens after you’ve gone for the true that purge malpractice if you national come into the presence.

[29:41] And what’s cool about it is that those are using your best ideas come when you think about,
when you’re in the shower and you have those ideas or you got a long drive and you decide to turn off the radio and you just got your mind can wander and jump around,
that moment before you fall asleep in your own my gosh this idea that i’ve been thinking about all day finally you know the answer.

[29:59] When a brain slows down a kind of scripts away all the busy ness of life,
and allows the sparks innovation to come out and so that’s where than once the sparks come we want to use the innovation in a very clear seven step process to take that idea and really lighted up.

[30:16] That’s so true though and i was at some sort of like sponsor some of the matter is you had a.
A shower pad in the shower someone created it is like a water proof paper white proof and all that and we can actually write your ideas down in the shower in that spa,
cause i think is the right thing and quiet that’s what we get our inspiration whether your height that i got on inspiration hiking,
or do i and i’m taking my dog for a walk it’s.

[30:44] Yeah absolutely and so we look at the great religions of the world you look at many of like the self improvement it’s all.
Taking the ordinary and then the extraordinary comes we somehow remove ourselves from id so they can be in a variety of different ways but slow.

[31:01] Slow down for more productive is a great,
so the listener out there that’s listen to this episode is interview will who would be an ideal person to to contact you reach out to you for your for your consulting services or any of the other services you have to offer.

[31:19] Yeah so it kinda depends on the price points i have a lot of digital services that walk people through exactly how to start a private practice in a free twenty step checklist people can get over practiceofthepractice.com/start.
Then i have a few other kind of smaller products for people to just wanted really bootstrapping to walk them through that,
we got the ideal client regards to consulting people that are just starting a practice and they just wanted to go really quickly so i think about one of my consulting clients for colorado,
who he contacted me before he started his practice and within eighteen months of fourteen person group practice after doing that so,
so not really want that rapid growth like there in it and i just kinda limping along in bootstrapping they’re ready to go in the other side of people that maybe had a solo practice that’s been really successful,
they are looking leveling up in some forms not having clinicians to the practice and consulting the products during,
niece or something along those lines where they know that they can i got to the top where they can get the making six figures but they know,
the only way to make money with the current model is to see more people and they’re not willing to do that and so,
got in contact you say okay i’m ready expand and i need your help to do that so we walk through,
exactly how to do that with the project management system so that they know exactly what the one thing is that they need to do in between sessions.

[32:37] Okay so practiceofhepractice.com sports last woman time.
Yes of course start would be for the twenty that check when i get people that are interested in consulting it before slash consulting so practice what practice that count for slash consulting.
And you also have the number one podcast the counselors which is available on itunes and google play music as well yeah looking all over the place you can listen to it directly,
from the website listed and whatever your favorite player is on all those will go i appreciate your time and,
when on the have your show i appreciate your giving attitude as well before recording shows like how can i help you how can i help you and i’m like wow,
i appreciate that so i appreciate your attitude your wisdom and just all the value given to us listening and i think so much and i say this is podcast grow.

[33:23] Thanks so much.

[33:24] Music.

[33:30] Set you want to subscribe to brian’s podcast just search the business of psychotherapy in your favor podcast player,
and thanks so much for letting me into yours and into your brain at next week with his mother commented false that you see therapists making as a transition to a private pay practice.

[33:48] I think i going off of what we was talking about fear of raising their rates i think is a really big fear.
Question is the band silences sexy for your intro music in this podcast is design right actor forgive information react with subject matter covered is given with the,
understanding that neither the host publisher or get surrounding legal accounting or other clinical information in a professional go find one.

[34:16] Music.